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Date:      Thu, 6 Jan 2022 09:41:33 -0700
From:      Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>
To:        Stefan Blachmann <sblachmann@gmail.com>
Cc:        FreeBSD Hackers <freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org>
Subject:   Re: 5.9 points Re: 7.0 points 5.1 points Re: Call for Foundation-supported Project Ideas
Message-ID:  <CANCZdfoa5AAYAs7p8=sOm9PFeW51=kHp1z1dfFzi=AVzpr-Syw@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CACc-My3Ekd%2B-ioZ4Vzx-xfeziQ4c%2BoCxOKOi60gegQQ7K35h3g@mail.gmail.com>
References:  <CADqw_gJuU6_Wt-GEJduz_Tm0oQg4dDv-5XDz1bsgWqtCmp1R2w@mail.gmail.com> <CAAcX-AHCom%2B5Zf2ENf%2BcFxPDrCWY=e_EaXfRamd%2BwnynBn1-VQ@mail.gmail.com> <864k6qj6x6.fsf@phe.ftfl.ca> <86zgoihs64.fsf@phe.ftfl.ca> <CACc-My26b1GZ7_s93Jx-DgeA=8%2BdS_2MYSoCv_D6uzRihyNHNQ@mail.gmail.com> <CANCZdfq7s2ODPbrZRztXQ7q1aMeDtK-bsoEoW%2BZKDkiyktKUSQ@mail.gmail.com> <CACc-My1WHdgxidCiYDW2RrWxM4sKao7o_Tw-pZuuE_Y0WXC4JQ@mail.gmail.com> <CANCZdfpb=Oq1hgLRYk59duCRgVjVtu5bd4VAKR8wbgJdoi9vDg@mail.gmail.com> <CACc-My0NLTpH6Ttogcx6-XD1svsbVpg5kJaH5v8r=CiQ%2BXvMkg@mail.gmail.com> <CANCZdfoRLM2VdGCGZAEeMF0Wt%2Bw0VZ20Zr1c0F14xLUcUFPPdg@mail.gmail.com> <YdbDY0B7VjSM59c3@bec.de> <CACc-My3Ekd%2B-ioZ4Vzx-xfeziQ4c%2BoCxOKOi60gegQQ7K35h3g@mail.gmail.com>

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On Thu, Jan 6, 2022, 9:35 AM Stefan Blachmann <sblachmann@gmail.com> wrote:

> Correct.
> Only late in the discussion Warner mentioned that the kms drm drivers
> need to be loaded.
> So my request has became moot.
>
> The drm kmod drivers usually are being associated as graphics drivers for
> xorg.
> Thus it is not at all intuitive/obvious that these are also required
> on console-only computers to make resuming succeed.
>
> Given this, it is rather a *documentation* *issue*, as the necessity
> to install/load the drm kmod drivers is *not* mentioned anywhere in
> the documentation regarding suspend/resume, making users wonder why
> resuming fails.
>

Absolutely agreed on need more docs and an update pass. I raised it as part
of this year's core team meeting with the foundation. Though this one issue
likely can be handled by a simple document PR.

Warner


> On 1/6/22, Joerg Sonnenberger <joerg@bec.de> wrote:
> > On Wed, Jan 05, 2022 at 11:22:39AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote:
> >> Why bother. Load the kms drm drivers. The suspend/resume code is in
> those
> >> drivers. They work console, X11 and wayland, more or less.  It's an
> >> absolutely
> >> insane idea to spend limited funds on the crazy ideas presented in this
> >> thread.
> >> They are known to be flakey, unreliable or technically just not
> possible.
> >
> > The main problem is that modern VGA devices often only have just enough
> > VESA BIOS support to give Windows a generic framebuffer as fallback.
> > Otherwise, I don't think it is as flakey. All that said, spending funds
> > on it would certainly be misdirected.
> >
> > Joerg
> >
> >
>
>

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<div dir=3D"auto"><div><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" =
class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, Jan 6, 2022, 9:35 AM Stefan Blachmann &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:sblachmann@gmail.com">sblachmann@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>=
</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l=
eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Correct.<br>
Only late in the discussion Warner mentioned that the kms drm drivers<br>
need to be loaded.<br>
So my request has became moot.<br>
<br>
The drm kmod drivers usually are being associated as graphics drivers for x=
org.<br>
Thus it is not at all intuitive/obvious that these are also required<br>
on console-only computers to make resuming succeed.<br>
<br>
Given this, it is rather a *documentation* *issue*, as the necessity<br>
to install/load the drm kmod drivers is *not* mentioned anywhere in<br>
the documentation regarding suspend/resume, making users wonder why<br>
resuming fails.<br></blockquote></div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><di=
v dir=3D"auto">Absolutely agreed on need more docs and an update pass. I ra=
ised it as part of this year&#39;s core team meeting with the foundation. T=
hough this one issue likely can be handled by a simple document PR.</div><d=
iv dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Warner</div><div dir=3D"auto"><=
br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"=
gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-=
left:1ex">
<br>
On 1/6/22, Joerg Sonnenberger &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:joerg@bec.de" target=3D=
"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">joerg@bec.de</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; On Wed, Jan 05, 2022 at 11:22:39AM -0700, Warner Losh wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; Why bother. Load the kms drm drivers. The suspend/resume code is i=
n those<br>
&gt;&gt; drivers. They work console, X11 and wayland, more or less.=C2=A0 I=
t&#39;s an<br>
&gt;&gt; absolutely<br>
&gt;&gt; insane idea to spend limited funds on the crazy ideas presented in=
 this<br>
&gt;&gt; thread.<br>
&gt;&gt; They are known to be flakey, unreliable or technically just not po=
ssible.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; The main problem is that modern VGA devices often only have just enoug=
h<br>
&gt; VESA BIOS support to give Windows a generic framebuffer as fallback.<b=
r>
&gt; Otherwise, I don&#39;t think it is as flakey. All that said, spending =
funds<br>
&gt; on it would certainly be misdirected.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Joerg<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
<br>
</blockquote></div></div></div>

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