Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2024 22:38:39 +0100 From: Mario Marietto <marietto2008@gmail.com> To: paul beard <paulbeard@gmail.com> Cc: FreeBSD Mailing List <freebsd-questions@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: How to upgrade an EOL FreeBSD release or how to make it working again Message-ID: <CA%2B1FSija47P8SY7zL-5KzgZ30vgcPtykEN3HiJXbo4rZbFoObw@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <CAMtcK2p%2Bs5%2B1-QYC_%2BUceOz_DFDUsfzwL4dePh9TX%2BDnh=78og@mail.gmail.com> References: <CA%2B1FSihU4WJWbbD9k9th4GXvyAKTL3URic-BAFUY7Og=wLn27A@mail.gmail.com> <CA390EE5-3339-4A15-8087-C28B309FA523@mit.edu> <CA%2B1FSih6j0QP9nKkxFCjMCeuMdvJca3WxVsi8%2BQaN2sV8YO-zw@mail.gmail.com> <D435604C-70F1-454D-B3AE-CD4D7C99D383@FreeBSD.org> <CAMtcK2p%2Bs5%2B1-QYC_%2BUceOz_DFDUsfzwL4dePh9TX%2BDnh=78og@mail.gmail.com>
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--0000000000007687a8060f02d869 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable What is NetBSD for ? On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 9:53=E2=80=AFPM paul beard <paulbeard@gmail.com> wr= ote: > This is usually where someone asks if OP has heard of NetBSD. > > https://www.netbsd.org > > On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 10:16=E2=80=AFAM David Chisnall <theraven@freebsd= .org> > wrote: > >> On 15 Jan 2024, at 16:46, Mario Marietto <marietto2008@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > The ARM Chromebook is based on armv7,it is still recent. >> >> For reference, the ARMv7 architecture was introduced in 2005. The last >> cores that implemented the architecture were released in 2014. This is = not >> a =E2=80=98recent=E2=80=99 architecture, it=E2=80=99s one that=E2=80=99s= 19 years old and has been largely >> dead for several years. >> >> > But let's change perspective for a moment,don't think about the ARM >> Chromebook. My question is : how to upgrade FreeBSD when it goes EOL. >> >> Generally, run `freebsd-update`. This is a very different question from >> =E2=80=98how do I do a new install of an old an unsupported version?' >> >> > I ask this because there is a huge difference here between FreeBSD and >> Linux. Today if you need to use , for example Ubuntu 14.0, you can use i= t >> as is. Yes,there will be a lot of bugs,but it will work without crashes. >> But if you want to use an old FreeBSD system,nothing will work for you. >> So,do you know some methods to install even packages or ports ? You >> know,there are cases when you need to do some experiments so that you ca= n >> keep your machine off the internet,so you aren't scared that someone can >> compromise it. Totally prohibiting the users to use an old system,removi= ng >> ports and packages is not a choice that I approve of. And I'm not the on= ly >> one that thinks like this. >> >> If you want to use an old and unsupported version of FreeBSD, no one is >> stopping you, but: >> >> - You will need to build the releases. The source code is still in git= , >> you can. The scripts for building the release images are right there in >> the repo. Just grab the relevant release or releng branch and go. >> >> - You will need to build packages. Newer versions of the ports tree >> will not be tested with the older release, so you may need to use an old= er >> checkout of the ports tree. Poudriere will build a package repo for you= . >> >> In both cases, if you=E2=80=99re using older versions you almost certain= ly *will* >> have security vulnerabilities. The project strongly advises you not to = do >> this and not to blame us when you install known-insecure software and en= d >> up compromised. >> >> The project does not have enough active contributors to keep maintaining >> things indefinitely. This is why release have a five-year supported >> lifetime. If you want to pick up an old branch and maintain it, you=E2= =80=99re >> welcome to. In the past, companies have picked up old branches and >> maintained them for customers that had a dependency on them. If you wan= t >> to pay someone to maintain an old branch (and have deep pockets) then th= ere >> are probably a few companies that will happily take your money. >> >> Maintaining binaries is a slightly different issue, but it=E2=80=99s not= totally >> unrelated. Keeping old packages around consumes disk space and costs th= e >> project money (remember, every package is mirrored across the CDN, so th= is >> isn=E2=80=99t just a single disk). Even if it were free, philosophicall= y, I think >> making it easy for users to install known-insecure software is a bad ide= a >> but if you want to keep a package repo with out-of-date packages online >> indefinitely then you can. You can run Poudriere and even cross-compile >> from a fairly beefy cloud machine quite easily. >> >> It=E2=80=99s been a while since I did a full package build, but I would = guess >> that you could do a single package build (all ports) for about $50 on a >> cloud VM, more (2-3x) if it=E2=80=99s emulated. Storing the results for= a small >> number of users will cost around $10-20/month. If you think this is an >> important thing to do, then you are absolutely welcome to spend your own >> money on doing it. >> >> David >> >> >> > > -- > Paul Beard / www.paulbeard.org/ > --=20 Mario. --0000000000007687a8060f02d869 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr">What is NetBSD for ? <br></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo= te"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 9:53=E2= =80=AFPM paul beard <<a href=3D"mailto:paulbeard@gmail.com">paulbeard@gm= ail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"= margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-lef= t:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">This is usually where someone asks if OP has heard = of NetBSD.=C2=A0<div><br></div><div><a href=3D"https://www.netbsd.org" targ= et=3D"_blank">https://www.netbsd.org</a><br></div></div><br><div class=3D"g= mail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 1= 0:16=E2=80=AFAM David Chisnall <<a href=3D"mailto:theraven@freebsd.org" = target=3D"_blank">theraven@freebsd.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote = class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px sol= id rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On 15 Jan 2024, at 16:46, Mario Marie= tto <<a href=3D"mailto:marietto2008@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">mariett= o2008@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br> > <br> > The ARM Chromebook is based on armv7,it is still recent.<br> <br> For reference, the ARMv7 architecture was introduced in 2005.=C2=A0 The las= t cores that implemented the architecture were released in 2014.=C2=A0 This= is not a =E2=80=98recent=E2=80=99 architecture, it=E2=80=99s one that=E2= =80=99s 19 years old and has been largely dead for several years.<br> <br> > But let's change perspective for a moment,don't think about th= e ARM Chromebook. My question is : how to upgrade FreeBSD when it goes EOL.= <br> <br> Generally, run `freebsd-update`.=C2=A0 This is a very different question fr= om =E2=80=98how do I do a new install of an old an unsupported version?'= ;<br> <br> > I ask this because there is a huge difference here between FreeBSD and= Linux. Today if you need to use , for example Ubuntu 14.0, you can use it = as is. Yes,there will be a lot of bugs,but it will work without crashes.=C2= =A0 But if you want to use an old FreeBSD system,nothing will work for you.= So,do you know some methods to install even packages or ports ? You know,t= here are cases when you need to do some experiments so that you can keep yo= ur machine off the internet,so you aren't scared that someone can compr= omise it. Totally prohibiting the users to use an old system,removing ports= and packages is not a choice that I approve of. And I'm not the only o= ne that thinks like this.<br> <br> If you want to use an old and unsupported version of FreeBSD, no one is sto= pping you, but:<br> <br> =C2=A0- You will need to build the releases.=C2=A0 The source code is still= in git, you can.=C2=A0 The scripts for building the release images are rig= ht there in the repo.=C2=A0 Just grab the relevant release or releng branch= and go.<br> <br> =C2=A0- You will need to build packages.=C2=A0 Newer versions of the ports = tree will not be tested with the older release, so you may need to use an o= lder checkout of the ports tree.=C2=A0 Poudriere will build a package repo = for you.=C2=A0 <br> <br> In both cases, if you=E2=80=99re using older versions you almost certainly = *will* have security vulnerabilities.=C2=A0 The project strongly advises yo= u not to do this and not to blame us when you install known-insecure softwa= re and end up compromised.<br> <br> The project does not have enough active contributors to keep maintaining th= ings indefinitely.=C2=A0 This is why release have a five-year supported lif= etime.=C2=A0 If you want to pick up an old branch and maintain it, you=E2= =80=99re welcome to.=C2=A0 In the past, companies have picked up old branch= es and maintained them for customers that had a dependency on them.=C2=A0 I= f you want to pay someone to maintain an old branch (and have deep pockets)= then there are probably a few companies that will happily take your money.= <br> <br> Maintaining binaries is a slightly different issue, but it=E2=80=99s not to= tally unrelated.=C2=A0 Keeping old packages around consumes disk space and = costs the project money (remember, every package is mirrored across the CDN= , so this isn=E2=80=99t just a single disk).=C2=A0 Even if it were free, ph= ilosophically, I think making it easy for users to install known-insecure s= oftware is a bad idea but if you want to keep a package repo with out-of-da= te packages online indefinitely then you can.=C2=A0 You can run Poudriere a= nd even cross-compile from a fairly beefy cloud machine quite easily.<br> <br> It=E2=80=99s been a while since I did a full package build, but I would gue= ss that you could do a single package build (all ports) for about $50 on a = cloud VM, more (2-3x) if it=E2=80=99s emulated.=C2=A0 Storing the results f= or a small number of users will cost around $10-20/month.=C2=A0 If you thin= k this is an important thing to do, then you are absolutely welcome to spen= d your own money on doing it.<br> <br> David<br> <br> <br> </blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div><span class=3D"gmail_si= gnature_prefix">-- </span><br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature">Pa= ul Beard / <a href=3D"http://www.paulbeard.org/" target=3D"_blank">www.paul= beard.org/</a><br></div> </blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><br><span class=3D"gmail_signature_pre= fix">-- </span><br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature">Mario.<br></d= iv> --0000000000007687a8060f02d869--
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