Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 15:31:13 -0700 From: Ulf Zimmermann <ulf@Alameda.net> To: Chris Dillon <cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us>, Atipa <freebsd@atipa.com> Cc: hackers@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: Will 8 Intel EtherExpress PRO 10/100's be a problem? Message-ID: <19980626153112.B24252@Alameda.net> In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSF.3.96.980626103304.13948B-100000@duey.hs.wolves.k12.mo.us>; from Chris Dillon on Fri, Jun 26, 1998 at 11:03:01AM -0500 References: <Pine.BSF.3.96.980625222607.24370A-100000@altrox.atipa.com> <Pine.BSF.3.96.980626103304.13948B-100000@duey.hs.wolves.k12.mo.us>
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On Fri, Jun 26, 1998 at 11:03:01AM -0500, Chris Dillon wrote: > On Thu, 25 Jun 1998, Atipa wrote: > > > > > > I really hope -hackers is the best place for this... i didn't want to > > > crosspost. > > > > > > Within the next few months, i will be needing to set up a router for our > > > internal network, tying together 7 networks, with some room to grow. I > > > plan on buying a rather expensive chassis from Industrial Computer source. > > > It has an interesting partially-passive backplane with a PII-233 or faster > > > and chipset mounted on it (LX or BX chipset, I believe) with everything > > > else on a daughtercard and 9PCI/8ISA slots. Something like the model > > > 7520K9-44H-B4 with redundant power supplies. > > > > Cool. > > > > > Basically my questions are: > > > > > > 1) Will there be any problems with using three or more host-to-PCI > > > bridges? > > > > Maybe not in the kernel, but I'd start to worry about saturating your > > buses. You are really bumping up against some I/O bottlenecks in my > > estimation. > > I'm rather hoping that three 133MB/sec PCI busses won't have any trouble > passing at max about 30MB/sec worth of data (10MB/sec per card, three > cards per bus). Theoretically even one PCI bus could handle all 8 of > those cards.. _theoretically_... :-) Double that number, Full Duplex is what you usual now use in routers. I also wouldn't say the single bus is the problem, but the main PCI bus and the CPU will be a bottleneck. You will definatly not be able to run 8 cards at full speed (8 x 10Mbyte/sec x 2 (FullDuplex) = 160 MByte/sec) > > > > 2) Will there be any problems using up to 8 Intel Etherexpress Pro > > > 10/100's? If so, can I use a combination of those and some DEC > > > 21[0,1]4[0,1] cards? > > > > If the answer to question #1 is "No", then the same should be true for > > question #2. > > Of course. > > > > 3) If i ever end up using natd for all of this, would there be any > > > problems with it servicing those 7 networks (probably max 100 hosts per > > > network)? > > > > Dunno. Never used natd, but I would not _expect_ any difficulties. > > I didn't think there would be any problem either, but experience counts > for more than speculation. I've already used it with 5 networks, but only > about 5 hosts per network (small class lab). :-) > > > > I initially thought of just getting a nice ATX rackmount case and a nice > > > ASUS motherboard and using some of those ZNYX 4-port fast-ethernet cards. > > > Several reasons why I like the above idea better is because the support > > > for the Intel cards is apparently better, and replacing bad NICs would be > > > simple and inexpensive. If I DO end up going the ZNYX route, are there > > > any known problems with those 4-port cards? I'd need two of them, of > > > course, and the motherboard would most likely have an Intel card built > > > onto it also. Maybe I'll even eventually throw an ETInc sync serial card > > > in there for my T1 and use our Cisco 2514 elsewhere. > > > > Yow. I think you should diversify your services, and spread out the I/O > > and interfaces over a couple machines. You really don't want to put all > > your eggs in one basket. Smaller, more digestible chunks would mean > > cheaper hardware (to the point that your NET would probably be less), less > > disastrous failures, and fewer bottlenecks related to architecture (PCI, > > RAM, disk I/O, etc.). > > I would have to put all my eggs into a Cisco router basket, or an > "IP-switch" basket.. Either way, its gonna happen. This is not > ultra-critical. We are just a public K-12 school after all, and losing > service temporarily isn't going to cause anything but maybe some > lack-of-Internet withdrawl symptoms and a small management headache for > me, at this point in our overall scheme of things. Maybe later on it will > become more critical. Having said that, it would seem that the system I > described above might be overkill, but after careful thought and seeing > another local school (actually a community college with a very smart man > at the computer wheel) do the same thing with BSDi, i figured it would > work just fine for my purposes. And for a lot less money than with other > solutions. > > I just had second thoughts about putting the sync serial card in that > machine, since the way it will be laid out now, i could literally place a > switch in place of this router and reconfigure our gateway router and all > would work again in the event of failure. The reason I'm not doing that > in the first place is, among other reasons, switches pass the hailstorms > of broadcast traffic that Winblows clients and servers like to generate, > and routers don't. PLUS, I will be able to do NAT and maybe hand back a > few of the /24's we have (I'm keeping at least one). > > > > Other options I would have are either a 8-port or more Cisco router (ugh, > > > expensive), or a 3COM gigabit layer-3 IP switch (THAT would be nice, but > > > the pricetag is in the 5-digit area). I would MUCH rather use a very nice > > > FreeBSD system for this job. > > > > Or two ? :) > > Sure, I could create some kind of tiered approach with multiple routers > with redundant links between all the tiers (and use OSPF or something?). > Its a great idea, actually, but too expensive, and a bit complicated... > Glad I thought of it. :-) > > > > > > By the way, anyone know of any place cheaper than ICS for the components I > > > need? Even just someplace that sells good ATX rackmount cases and power > > > supplies (Jinco maybe)? > > > > www.atipa.com :) > > NICE. I don't see any rackmount cases though. Do you sell or can you get > any? If so, you're at the top of my list, just under a local guy that > says he can get me the stuff I want for wholesale. :-) > > > Regards, > > Kevin > > > -- Chris Dillon - cdillon@wolves.k12.mo.us - cdillon@inter-linc.net > /* FreeBSD: The fastest and most stable server OS on the planet. > For Intel x86 and compatibles (SPARC and Alpha under development) > (http://www.freebsd.org) */ > > > > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org > with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message -- Ulf. --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ulf Zimmermann, 1525 Pacific Ave., Alameda, CA-94501, #: 510-769-2936 Alameda Networks, Inc. | http://www.Alameda.net | Fax#: 510-521-5073 To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body of the message
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