Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 02:01:53 +1300 From: Joe Abley <jabley@clear.co.nz> To: Jim Bryant <jbryant@unix.tfs.net> Cc: Jamie Lawrence <jal@ThirdAge.com>, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.ORG, dennis.moore@mail.house.gov, jabley@clear.co.nz Subject: Re: Forward all spam to UCE@FTC.GOV [please take to -chat] Message-ID: <19990117020152.A812@clear.co.nz> In-Reply-To: <199901160945.DAA54755@unix.tfs.net>; from Jim Bryant on Sat, Jan 16, 1999 at 03:45:35AM -0600 References: <4.1.19990115143915.03abd400@mail.thirdage.com> <199901160945.DAA54755@unix.tfs.net>
next in thread | previous in thread | raw e-mail | index | archive | help
On Sat, Jan 16, 1999 at 03:45:35AM -0600, Jim Bryant wrote:
> In reply:
>
> > [absurd uneducated anarchist crotch-rot rant deleted]
>
> > >to disagree with this is to admit that self-policing the internet [or
> > >anything else for that matter] is an utterly sophistic concept that
> > >needs to be relegated to the status of fairie tale. which, by the way
> > >is a circular concept anyhow, since to agree with my reasoning is to
> > >admit the same. at least i have enough moral character to admit it.
> >
> > What? You're not making any sense.
>
> what part did you not understand. self-regulation DOES NOT work, HAS
> NEVER worked, and WILL NEVER work. it is a historically sophistic
> concept. where there is no threat of punishment, there is no
> incentive to not do something.
>
> anarchists like you have made the internet a ROTTING CESSPOOL of
> criminal activity. every now and then the toilet does need flushed
> lest the whole house become diseased!
>
> [rest of shouting removed for the safety of others]
Your messages are interesting. I think you are both right, to a certain
extent.
Jim: Apart from a token mention of other countries in one paragraph, you
presuppose that
(a) the entire problem lies within the governance of a single entity,
namely the US
(b) that there is a conceivable mechanism for enforcing any law outlawing
UCE
Both these premises are faulty, in my opinion.
The problem of spam is not new; all forms of communication suffer from it
in one way or other. The problem with e-mail spam is that it is incredibly
cheap to originate, and it costs recipients money to receive.
For example, I get cold-called on my GSM phone when I am in other countries.
This costs me money much the same as the e-mail spam I receive costs me
money. It rarely happens, though, because it is expensive for the spammer
to do.
There are three ways I can see to defeat the spammers:
1. Make it free to receive spam. Practically, the only way to accomplish
this is to make all inbound e-mail free. This isn't practical at all.
2. Make it expensive to send spam. Practically, this could only be done
by making it expensive to send all e-mail. This won't happen.
3. Implement a technical solution based on end-to-end signatures and/or
cryptography, so that unsolicited mail will never be accepted. This would
effectively make spam pointless, since the target audience is removed.
If the internet is indeed a "rotting cesspool of criminal activity", then
it will not be improved by treating the symptoms - you need to attack the
cause.
If it is technically possible for spam to be sent, it will be sent. This
is the nature of humanity, and no amount of moral posturing or regional
lawmaking will stop it.
I have copied your senator, or congressman, or whoever you said he was.
My message to him is unsolicited. I am not (nor have I ever been) a US
citizen. What facet of US law is stopping me from doing this? What possible
future US law could stop me?
Is there any practical difference between this letter, and its content,
and another message I might have chosen to send advertising some pyramid
sales scheme? Again, which current or future US law could indict me?
Lawers and government will not save us from spam. That will only happen
by the application of thought from software engineers and protocol
architects.
Joe
To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org
with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message
Want to link to this message? Use this URL: <https://mail-archive.FreeBSD.org/cgi/mid.cgi?19990117020152.A812>