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Date:      Thu, 30 Jan 2003 01:04:39 -0800 (PST)
From:      Doug Barton <DougB@FreeBSD.org>
To:        William Palfreman <william@palfreman.com>
Cc:        Fred Clift <fclift@verio.net>, freebsd-chat@FreeBSD.org
Subject:   Re: 4.7-R-p3: j.root-servers.net 
Message-ID:  <20030130010126.Y341@12-234-22-23.pyvrag.nggov.pbz>
In-Reply-To: <20030130022654.C31399@aqua.lan.palfreman.com>
References:  <20030129163652.J22139-100000@vespa.dmz.orem.verio.net> <20030130022654.C31399@aqua.lan.palfreman.com>

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On Thu, 30 Jan 2003, William Palfreman wrote:

> On Wed, 29 Jan 2003, Fred Clift wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 27 Jan 2003, William Palfreman wrote:
> >
> > > mainstream root occur all the time - abusive behaviour by some
> > > government wannabees, abusive interference by courts in domain name
> > > ownership, ICANN, DDoS attacks, simple volume of traffic problems and
> >
> >
> > Are you saying that there is some other way than courts (or violence) to
> > ultimately resolve things that exist only in terms of law?  ie
> > 'ownership'?
>
> Yes, of course.  Agreement and mutual respect.  Domains name certainly
> do not exist only in terms of law.  They exist in the zonefile of the
> authoritative nameserver.  Ultimately that is where any disputes are
> settled.  Things like that don't really have anything to do with courts,
> less so once there are several roots (and overlapping TLDs), because a
> court simply cannot impose itself without the voluntary agreement the
> admin for the nameserver in question - which is as it should be.
>
> > Since the concept of ownership is basically just a legal definition, then
> > legal means will be (leaving out violence) the ultimate means of resolving
> > issues surrounding it.
>
> Legal means are not leaving out violence.  They are violent.  If someone
> lives in a country where a court decision goes against them, no matter
> how illegitimate that court decision, if they do not go along with it
> they can be fined ad imprisoned - and if they don't accept either
> police will come and arrest you, shooting if you resist.  Courts are the
> very epitome of violence.

I'm re-posting your whole message (something I don't usually do) because
you rather neatly made my point, and contradicted your first statement. It
is ENTIRELY possible that the courts (not the name server admins) will
have the final say in regards to domain name disputes, since they have the
ability to compel obedience to their edicts.

Like it or not, domain names are part of business, and business and law
are tightly intertwined.

Doug

-- 

    If it's moving, encrypt it. If it's not moving, encrypt
      it till it moves, then encrypt it some more.

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