Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2011 21:52:16 +0100 From: Samuel Magnusson <samuel.magnusson5@bredband.net> To: freebsd-questions@freebsd.org Subject: Re: X server and xinit works excellent....almost. Message-ID: <4EBAE800.6040807@bredband.net> In-Reply-To: <20111109191557.f5ce0bfd.freebsd@edvax.de> References: <4EB88225.9020702@bredband.net> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1111080806260.70888@wonkity.com> <20111108205600.7a8e0205.freebsd@edvax.de> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1111081321010.72738@wonkity.com> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1111081331150.72921@wonkity.com> <20111108215114.24d336e6.freebsd@edvax.de> <4EBA5EBD.7020501@bredband.net> <20111109191557.f5ce0bfd.freebsd@edvax.de>
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Polytropon wrote 2011-11-09 19:15: > On Wed, 09 Nov 2011 12:06:37 +0100, Samuel Magnusson wrote: >> Is it then so that in the "new style" Xorg the XML-method will override >> HAL, and this is the new default way of providing opitons that formerly >> were in the InputDevice sections in xorg.conf? > I hope not! :-) > > As far as I understood the _current_ mechanism, the precedence > is 1st xorg.conf, 2nd XML stuff, 3rd autodetect. > > You have X without HAL and DBUS? Use xorg.conf because this > has worked for many years to centralize X configuration. > > You have X with HAL and DBUS, but don't want to use it? Reflect > this choice in xorg.conf and continue with previous settings. > > You have X with HAL and DBUS, but some things aren't detected > properly? Dive into the fun of XML and enter your settings in > the appropriate files, whichever they currently may be. :-) > > There _are_ things that cannot be autodetected, and HAL needs > to be configured to "notice" a localization "deviation" from > the standard, which is en_US. That's what you are going to use > the XML stuff for. I like that precedence list, because the old way seems much clearer and simpler to me. If autodetection only does half the detecting and then lays the burden of a new and more complicated manual configuration, then not much is gained. And why on earth could they not just have left what needed to be manually configured in the xorg.conf and make it override the HAL default mode? That would be the logical and easy way, in my inexperienced opinion. So as I understand it from my mistakes this precedence list is only true under certain circumstances, and I fell in a nice little devilish newbie-trap. :) When I first installed Xorg I began by following the handbook, which means that I unwittingly did this to my poor rc.conf: hald_enable="YES" dbus_enable="YES" That meant that I would HAVE to go into the XML-stuff (to get swedish keys) , because I could configure the InputDevice section until blue in my face (which I also did), and still nothing would happen witht the keyboard layout. Because with HAL and DBUS enabled this InputDevice section is bypassed unless I also specify Option "AutoAddDevices" "false". Which I understand gives the same result as not enabling HAL and DBUS in the first place. Its just an unnecessary circle, first enabling, then disabling. I have to give cred to the FreeBSD handbook because it is actually quite correct and clear on this point (as no other text I found was) and tells what to do if wanting to do it the old way. But for some reason that I cannot recall now, I didn't understand it right away and strayed away from the handbook to among other things the X.org website and the man pages and other introductory books, which doesn't warn about this at all. It just assumes that xorg.conf sections works as usual. But it didn't to my hald-enabled system. I never returned to the handbook, because I stumbled on the working method with setxkbmap which did override the HAL default layout. I left it as a big question mark to maybe get back to it later. When I started this thread I had no idea that my problem with zap could be related to the same keyboard problem I had encountered earlier. ...so I'm learning. :) > Can you tell me _how_ anything in software is supposed to > know what characters are printed on the key caps of the > keyboard? I'm not sure keyboard vendors do code localization > variants into their USB identification numbers... > No I can't. :) I realized the unprobability of this when hitting the send button. And your comment is also a good argument for keeping the simpler keyboard configuration in xorg.conf, isn't it? Couldn't autodetection of the keyboard work together with xorg.conf just like when giving the command "X -configure" and /root/xorg.config.new is created? For example that detected my monitor, my graphics card and my installed drivers, and it put those as entrys in the file so it is easy to edit and add options if necessary. HAL could just put "pc105" into the normal InputDevice section and let me fill in the Layout... What is there more than "pc105" to autodetect then that I would need HAL to make my life easier? I guess these are decisions to be made by X.org though, and not by me.. I just wonder. :) Anyway, can you stand one more "just curious"-question from me? When I used the vesa and nouveau drivers they were automatically kldloaded when the X server read the xorg.conf file. But the nVidia driver I have to kldload manually because otherwise the X server doesn't find it. Of course I will put it in loader.conf, but is it normal? Should it not be loaded authomatically as the others?
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