Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2018 08:12:52 -0700 From: Randi Harper <randi@freebsdgirl.com> To: Erich Dollansky <freebsd.ed.lists@sumeritec.com> Cc: Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>, "FreeBSD, Advocacy" <freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org>, "Julian H. Stacey" <jhs@berklix.com>, FreeBSD Core Team <core@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: CoC does not help in benchmarks Message-ID: <CAM9wqY-W_d6GtDSCcTUPZ9LXN3VGp6-iVOF8qpUyzUG60vgFZg@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <20180716152421.21df05df.freebsd.ed.lists@sumeritec.com> References: <20180714064429.36c6bc43.freebsd.ed.lists@sumeritec.com> <201807151821.w6FILUXj094865@fire.js.berklix.net> <20180716072622.198015fe.freebsd.ed.lists@sumeritec.com> <CANCZdfrCny%2BeE0_BN0ZNAgrrqqFTupJ%2BYmxugyZUVDU4qiWYDQ@mail.gmail.com> <20180716152421.21df05df.freebsd.ed.lists@sumeritec.com>
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On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 12:24 AM, Erich Dollansky < freebsd.ed.lists@sumeritec.com> wrote: > Hi, > > On Sun, 15 Jul 2018 17:31:04 -0600 > Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> wrote: > > > On Sun, Jul 15, 2018 at 5:26 PM, Erich Dollansky < > > freebsd.ed.lists@sumeritec.com> wrote: > > > > > > Does anybody need more: > > > > > > Keep it civil. > > > Be tolerant. > > > Remember that you are in public and that your actions determine > > > the public perception of the project. Do not make it personal. Do > > > not take it personally. > > > > > > > Such overly-simply CoCs have proven unworkable in the past. They were > > OK in the 90's, but we live in a different internet world today. > > These are good guidelines and great advice, but make it hard to take > > action when necessary. I wish it were not so. > > > > Warner > > what kind of action can be done with the new CoC that could not have > been done with the old CoC? > > Erich > > You know, I really try to stay far, far away from these conversations, despite being part of one of the events that made the CoC more of a priority. But I'm not associated with the project anymore, and I don't have a reputation that I'm concerned about, so I'm going to take this time to be free with my words. I'm sure some idiot is going to come on here and find something about this email insulting and try to say that I'm breaking CoC. gg. Listen up. You are a software developer. You are fully aware of the idea that there are edge cases that come up with software that you didn't write code to explicitly handle. You understand that regardless of your personal experience in the field, there are going to be things that happen that are either outside your control or just exceed your current level of understanding given your experience. Recognizing that you don't know everything, that you can't know everything, and that some people have more experience or a different experience than you is part of what makes a good software developer great. It's also what makes someone a pleasure to work with. Play to your expertise. Utilize others for their expertise where you are lacking. I think these are probably concepts that a lot of us can agree upon. When it comes to dealing with policy, it's really not that different. If you cannot see the problem with the old CoC or see why a CoC is needed in the first place, it's because you do not have understanding of the events that led to this decision, and you don't have the experience to divine further context. Maybe you just suck at people. You certainly wouldn't be the first engineer to be lacking in that department. But you didn't come here with an understanding of your own lack of expertise, you didn't come looking for someone that could share their experience with you. You came looking to complain with a snarky comment about performance. You could have asked in a non-confrontational manner or bothered to google or read mailing list archives to find out the history of why the CoC came about. No one wants to get into it because it remains a giant fucking mess, and frankly, some of the people involved (like me!) just want to see the conversation about those events die because they continue to get harassed about it to this very day. You do not know everything behind why this CoC was created. None of us likely do. That's fine. You and I are not in charge of the CoC. Thank fucking god, because I wouldn't want to be part of core and having to deal with this clusterfuck of babies crying about their rights to be buttheads to each other and how having a set of rules makes FreeBSD perform slower and how <insert edge case here because some idiot just feels like creating an argument because he read on slashdot about how SJWs are taking over open source>. I mean, seriously. Do you honestly think the same people responsible for the CoC are all also working on performance improvements 100% of the time? That's right. There's only 12 developers currently working on FreeBSD and we don't let them out of the basement except for as a reward for good behaviour. Have you seen the photos of various devsummits? Photoshop, baby. Since when did we measure the success of the project by some random fucking benchmark? I am not in any way a part of this project anymore, but I continue to read these mailing lists because I'm some kind of masochist that really honestly cares about seeing the project do well even after I left. There are many people in FreeBSD that I will always consider family. It was my home for many, many years. And it has been eye opening how many idiots - whose names, by the way, i sure as fuck don't recognize from any of the devsummits or conferences - come onto this mailing list with their concern trolls because they seem to think that core or the CoC enforcement team must be idiots and would fall for anything. They are running the fucking project. They were elected. If you've got a good argument make it, but this shit is disrespectful. I'm not sure if it's true that FreeBSD lost a few developers, but now that there's a CoC, more people will likely contribute because they will feel safer there. Few people want to contribute to a project that cares more for LoC than the humans behind the code. I really don't care if the project lost some primadonnas that were mortally offended that they were asked to act like decent human beings. Good riddance. If you don't like how the project is being run, there are steps to fix this: 1.) Contribute code to FreeBSD. 2.) Become a FreeBSD committer. 3.) Run for core. 4.) Change the policy. Elections are held every 2 years. See you in 2020.
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