Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 18:46:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Das Devaraj <das@netcom.com> To: Dan Janowski <danj@3skel.com> Cc: chat@FreeBSD.ORG Subject: Re: What else goes with it (was Re: New name?) Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9804132025.A24573-0100000@netcom4> In-Reply-To: <3532D844.E173B93C@3skel.com>
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On Mon, 13 Apr 1998, Dan Janowski wrote: > > - Specify whom this system is for > > (currently FreeBSD seems geared for server applications) > > This is not really true. It seems that way because there is ashortage of > desktop type applications. When I installed Apache on FreeBSD 2.2.5 *think* it brought up six copies. Surely, a set-up for a server? :-) Granted these things are easy enough to correct (fix?), if one reads the accompanying documentation. The standard installation(?) also installed other server type stuff (like sendmail). Sorry don't have the machine close by, otherwise would have given the exact list. Also FreeBSD seems to be infinitely customizable (which is a good thing). Normally this extreme flexibility is given for server type systems. > We are not going to hit the MS desktop. The completeness and > ease of use for most is there. My plan was not to go against the MS desktop. Also I am not implying that the completeness and ease are lacking. Only that it is well hidden, unless you have a certain amount of computer knowledge or proficiency. A buddy of mine wanted a high end OS (don't know why) and I recommended FreeBSD. After two months and going through three books, he still did not have a high end OS :-( So he went the NT route. Now he is planning to buy a used true UNIX box. RTFM is the mantra which is chanted quite often as an cure for this. But IMHO, somebody coming in cold will have a very steep learning curve, even to have a basic working system. A very interesting point to consider is that the person mentioned in the previous paragraph, who valiantly struggled for two months, has a doctorate degree - not in CS :-) > If not a server or a common desktop, then what? I deal with a lot with newbies (in fact I am in the middle of starting a Unix training center, in Pleasant Hill, CA). Just in the last couple of months, the contractor who worked in my office suite, fast food restaurant manager, real estate person, medical doctor and other folks have expressed an interest in learning Unix! RTFM is not going to cut with folks like these. FreeBSD is currently geared for an extremely technical audience. That is why I followed the -newbies list with interest to see how that would go. They allow only meta-level discussions (like how to solve a problem and not the actual solution). Know why they do it ["teach a person to fish..." - not a vegan thing to do :-) ]. My take is, if somebody is bleeding from a cut, administer the first aid -- not stick a first aid book in the victim's hand and say RTFM. FreeBSD well may be targeted at an educated, technically elite audience. Everything that I see points towards that. My point is very simple - it may be very difficult or even impossible for the current FreeBSD structure to cater to anybody else. That is why I suggested that a different organization to try to market FreeBSD (under a different name) to businesses, real newbies etc. for a price. Not that I did not say anything hacking the kernel or other tech wizardry - just repacking. > UI for a more graphical desktop/system manager. People getfreaked out > when they have to deal with the system itself. > Everything from permissions to installing software. Who can > we really appeal to in a mass market? You are right about people getting freaked out. At each step of the installation process, the question is "now what?" After everything is done, it is "What do I click?" My guess is that some of the same newbies would not have a problem with RedHat Linux - I am planning to do some tests. Getting a successful installation itself will be an achievement for many. One quick anecdote - a buddy of mine, an NT admin, wanted to desperately setup a Unix server at his work -- resume reads better, he gets more money, now that he knows Unix etc). My recommendation was to go with FreeBSD. Since the whole show was happening at his office, could not really help him more than that. In more than a month, he could not get his system up and running. Too many things to read. To answer your question about the market, these are the markets the "repackaged/renamed" FreeBSD will try to cover. If it is possible to get branded also, it would be even better. > Are we tring to put ourselves more squarely > in the Unix Server market or are we going after > the home user that plays with Linux now, but > may be interested in something more serious. > Or something else? I don't view Linux as our enemy. Just brotherly rivalry, that is all. The recreational user and corporate market, as was mentioned before was what I had in mind. das To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message
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