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Date:      Fri, 3 Mar 2000 20:45:51 -0500
From:      andu <undo@cloud9.net>
To:        freebsd-newbies@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: FreeBSD Newbies First Aid Kit
Message-ID:  <00030321165900.00428@ydl.andu>
References:  <200003040130.MAA28760@phoenix.welearn.com.au>

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On Fri, 03 Mar 2000, Sue Blake wrote:

I'm sure this is meant to help and keep things in order but to me it sounds a
little like over medication. 
A newbie asks questions to get something going, to
have some motivation to go on. 

> FreeBSD-Newbies First Aid Kit
>                                        
>    (This is a regular posting to the FreeBSD-Newbies mailing list.
>    It is also available at http://www.welearn.com.au/freebsd/newbies/)
>    
>    FreeBSD-Questions@FreeBSD.ORG is the place to send all questions about
>    installing, configuring, running and using FreeBSD. All help requests
>    are handled by FreeBSD-Questions, including newbies questions.
>    
>    FreeBSD-Newbies is different. We don't ask for help or answer how-to
>    questions. It is a discussion forum for newbies.
>    
>    FreeBSD-Newbies provides a place for new FreeBSD users to meet and
>    covers any of the activities of newbies that are not already dealt
>    with elsewhere. Examples include helping each other to learn more on
>    our own, finding and using resources, problem solving techniques, how
>    to seek help elsewhere, how to use mailing lists and which lists to
>    use, general chat, making mistakes, boasting, sharing ideas, stories,
>    moral (but not technical) support, and taking an active part in the
>    FreeBSD community. 

I find it rather absurd to have a list where I can ask where I can ask for help.
I asked my question, I got a good answer, others benefited too and that's the
end of the story. I find it hard to believe that a FreeBsd beginner joins a list
just to hang out with other newbies.

>We take our problems and support questions to
>    freebsd-questions, and use freebsd-newbies to meet others who are
>    doing the same things that we do as newbies.
>    
>    One of the things we do together is learn more effective ways to find
>    help when we need it. Here are some suggestions:
>    
> When something doesn't work the way you expect
> 
>     1. First look at the errata for your release of FreeBSD at
>        http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/releases/ for the latest information and
>        security advisories.
>     2. Search the Handbook, FAQ, and mail archives at
>        http://www.FreeBSD.ORG/search.html
>     3. If you still have a question or problem, collect the output of
>        `uname -a' and of any relevant program(s) and email your question
>        to FreeBSD-questions@FreeBSD.ORG.
>        
> Mailing lists
> 
>    When you have a problem that you can't solve by yourself, there's only
>    one support mailing list and that's FreeBSD-questions@FreeBSD.ORG.
>    FreeBSD-questions helps with installation and basic setup as well as
>    more general and advanced questions.
>    
>    You don't have to actually join freebsd-questions before asking a
>    question there. Replies to your question will normally be sent to you
>    personally as well as to the list. Just make sure you have read and
>    followed the guidelines for posting, because you might find them
>    different to what you're used to. If you do subscribe to
>    freebsd-questions you'll have the advantage of seeing all of the
>    recent questions and their answers.
>    
>    Before you post to FreeBSD-questions, please read the guidelines at
>    http://www.lemis.com/questions.html Many of the people who answer
>    FreeBSD-questions are very knowledgeable, but they get frustrated when
>    they get questions which are difficult to understand.
>    http://www.lemis.com/email.html is worth reading too.
>    
>    If you're not sure that you can follow these guidelines, come back and
>    ask the other newbies for help on how to post an effective question to
>    the support mailing list.
>    
>    Maybe your question has been asked before. If you search the mailing
>    list archives at http://www.freebsd.org/search.html first you might
>    get the answer right away. It's always worth trying.
>    
>    Other mailing lists
>    (http://www.freebsd.org/handbook/eresources.html#ERESOURCES-CHARTERS)
>    cover specialised areas and many are more developer-oriented. You'll
>    need to read their charters carefully before participating, but it's
>    probably a good idea to ask on either -newbies or -questions for
>    advice about where to post a more specialised question.
>    
>    FreeBSD-announce is a very low volume read-only list for occasional
>    announcements, such as notice of new releases, and the Really Quick
>    Newsletter. It's worth subscribing to FreeBSD-announce too.
>    
> Manuals
> 
>    You'll always be expected to show that you have made some effort to
>    use the available documentation before asking for help. That's not
>    always as easy as it sounds!
>    
>    If you know what documentation you need but can't locate it, send a
>    brief query to FreeBSD-questions. If you don't know what you need,
>    always have trouble finding it, or can't make any sense of it when you
>    do, ask some patient newbies to steer you in the right direction.
>    
>    Anyone interested in writing or reviewing documentation for FreeBSD is
>    encouraged to join the FreeBSD Documentation Project. Details are at
>    http://www.freebsd.org/docproj/docproj.html
>    
> Other resources
> 
>    A resource list is available at
>    http://www.freebsd.org/projects/newbies.html to help new and
>    inexperienced FreeBSD users to find relevant information quickly. It
>    includes books, on line documents and tutorials, and links to web
>    pages that other newbies have found useful for learning. If you have a
>    suggestion for good material to be included, please write to
>    freebsd-newbies and tell us about it.
>    
> But I have seen people asking questions here!
> 
>    It is quite common for people to send the wrong kind of post to a
>    mailing list. Because we're newbies it'll certainly happen here from
>    time to time. The best thing to do if you see a message that doesn't
>    belong on a list is to ignore it. There's always someone around whose
>    job it is to sort these problems out privately.
>    
>    The posts to the lists go straight through, whatever their content. It
>    is going to be confusing for a little while because we're all newbies
>    so we all make mistakes. That's OK.
>    
>    One thing we're going to see a fair bit is people posting questions,
>    believing they're doing the right thing by posting here as newbies,
>    not realising how it works. If someone answers those questions the
>    situation will snowball. There's nothing wrong with helping someone to
>    redirect their question to freebsd-questions, but please do so gently.
>    There's nothing wrong with the occasional mistake either.
>    
>    So all questions, requests for help, etc still go to freebsd-questions
>    as usual. Ours is more of a discussion group, a place where newbies
>    can relax with other newbies and focus more on our successes than on
>    our temporary imperfection. We can talk about things here that are not
>    allowed on freebsd-questions. We're also a bit freer to make the
>    mistakes that we need to make in order to learn.

--
Regards, Andu


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