Date: Wed, 04 Oct 2000 13:49:07 -0700 From: xavian anderson macpherson <professional3d@home.com> To: "freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG" <freebsd-questions@FreeBSD.ORG>, tagdot57@aol.com, mongor@mail.com Subject: is the loader process of the 5.0-current toolkit different from the 4.0 four-disk set? Message-ID: <39DB97C3.81D20E85@home.com>
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i have tried booting using the kern.flp and mfsroot.flp from the
5.0-current (june 2000) on the first cd of the 6-cd toolkit set. i am
not even able to get beyond the device selection in the installation
process.
i cannot boot from my scsi-cdrom, the controller is non-bootable. the
program leaves the selection point and tries to initialize the aic0
modules for my SOUNDBLASTER 16 (CT 1770 from compaq) SCSI card. it just
loops (aimlessly spinning the scsi-cdrom which i need to load the
system; i geuss) trying to determine the parameters for the device.
(there was a box in the configuration for that device that was labeled
`flag'; i set the entry there to 0x340, which is the address of my scsi
card; there was no entry for irq; if this `flag' is not for the address
[why the 0x0 then], what is it for?). even prior to this (the point
where it is attempting to read the cdrom), i noticed that it was unable
to ascertain the parameters of the pnp-devices.
there is a module (under miscellaneous) called pc-card controller. it
conflicts with the irq (10) of my NE2000 (REALTEK RTL-8029) ethernet
card. i thought i needed this to read my pci+isa cards; i just found
this is really for pcmcia. but i do remember trying to continue without
this, but it still didn't work! so i removed the ethernet card module
in desparation, thinking that if i could only get the system installed,
then i could then go back later and deal with web communications. is
ex0 the module for my intel ethernet express card?
nice plan! except that it does not work! i chose the 5.0-current,
because according to someone from this list, it is the only version that
allows me to have the kernel (with vinum support) and all of it's
components in the /boot directory. i felt i would need this ability to
mount /boot with the kernel and all of it's modules, configs, (etc) onto
it's own partition as i do with linux. yes, to the person that
commented about the 1024 cylinder limit; i am using lilo, because my
current `/' is on hdd1 (or wd3s1). in fact i had two (2) `/'s. one on
wd3s1 (for linux-mandrake-7.0 with it's 1750 rpms) and the other for
suse-6.4 (and it's 465 rpms; which i am still using on wd3s1). i will
quote that message below.
as a last resort, can i just copy sysinstall(which may very well run in
linux) to my harddisk, to format my disks and load freebsd from linux?
i just tried and succeeded in formatting and mounting /dev/hdd4(linux)
or /dev/wd3s4(freebsd), using YaST(a suse-linux program) to type
b7(which is BSDI fs). i have several options (using YaST) which i can
format my disks as;
86 NTFS Volume set
87 NTFS Volume set
8E Linux LVM
a5* OpenBSD
b7* BSDI fs
b8* BSDI swap
fd Linux raid auto
63 GNU HURD o SysV
64* Novell Netware
65* Novell Netware
3c Partition Magic
7 HPFS/NTFS
the partition types followed by an asterisk seem like they would be the
most compatable of the group. i am geussing that types 63 and 64 are
the NFS types mentioned in
=======================================================================
JONATHAN WRITES,
No. The location of the kernel is arbitrary, but must be located where
the loader can find it. Since the loader doesn't understand vinum
filesystems, this is why you can't put the kernel on a vinum device.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
XAVIAN WRITES;
lilo (linux loader) for linux does not have this problem (it also
supports booting any number of os's; and with VMware, you can run them
concurrently). with lilo i can mount the `/' anywhere i want it (as
long as /boot is it's own partition). furthermore, i do not want to
mount the kernel on vinum. i want to put the kernel in /boot which
(again) would then be mounted on it's own partition. that partition
would not be on a vinum device. if the kernel is in /boot and mounted
on it's own (slice wd0s1) partition, the kernel would (then) mount first
(along with it's vinum support components) before the `/' device is even
mounted. thereby removing the `chicken and the egg' situation that
someone else refered to by the `/' not being able to mount, because it
is on a device that cannot be (defined, and subsequently) accessed by a
kernel that has not yet been loaded. let me also state that i need this
installation to be a shared os environment. if i had ERASED! my disk,
so that i would have a freebsd-only environment, i would have had to
RELOAD! all of my linux AGAIN!, just so that i could send this email to
get help. just imagine how any of you would have felt under the same
circumstances (and how much SHOUTING! you would be doing). as i stated
(very strongly) to the people in linux. it seems very ludicrous to talk
about superiority, when you can't even load the new environment without
absolutely ANY! dependency on microsoft or any other operating system to
get (environment parameters) information on the current environment to
load the new one. dependency is not superiority! if you think that is
unrealistic, how UNREALISTIC! is it to declare anything other than
MICROSOFT superior? and don't bother talking about my tone. if all i
had to do was insert the (boot) disks (which you don't provide, but
linux does) and start the system (as i do with linux), there would be no
tone! you can't even start the system without first depending on
MICROSOFT (which i don't have and don't want; although now, i am
beginning to wonder why?) or someone else to make the boot floppies.
how's that for a `chicken and the egg" convolution?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
HE CONTINUES,
In 5.x, the kernel and modules have been moved into a subdirectory of
/boot, so on -current, we now have the following structure:
/boot/kernel.GENERIC/kernel
/vesa.ko
/kernel.MACHINE/kernel
/vinum.ko
If you load the kernel + vinum module at boot time, I don't see any
technical reason why you can't mount a vinum partition as /, and then
overlay your /boot partition on top of that.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
XAVIAN WRITES,
that's what i was trying to say. he has essentially quoted (verbatum)
the very essense of my proposal. but he (or anyone else) still does not
see the solution in front of him. mount /boot with the kernel on it's
own slice (in `wd or sd0s1'). i am beginning to feel as though i
brought someone else's idea of a great car(aka, ferrari). only to find
out that i actually joined a garage of mechanics (however well equiped
or intentioned), who tell me that i first have to install the engine
(with chevy's tools) before i can drive it! not only that, but i have
to search around for (rare, and often incomplete) components to keep it
on the road once(if) i actually get it running! ferrari's are great.
but at least you can drive them off the showroom floor (without
borrowing parts from a chevy).
------------------------------------------------------------------------
HE CONTINUES,
However, in practical terms, mounting root is a "special" operation, and
must have per-filesystem support, so the actual code to support mounting
the vinum partition as / may not be present.
--
Jonathan (ends)
--------------------------------------------------------------------
XAVIAN WRITES,
JONATHAN, I AM SORRY. this is not directed at you personally. i am
just experiencing de je vu, all over again. i also went through similar
troubles with linux. however, if you use my (linux) approach, you don't
need any "special" operations or `actual code' to mount the vinum
device/partition/slice as `/'. but linux is (still a `bleeding edge
developement environment; which is) inferior and freebsd isn't.
some(any)thing so essential (as installetion) to an advanced system like
freebsd, should not be so difficult to use! if you want to get a real
sense of the simplicity that i LOATH! departing from, download a copy of
YaST from
ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/update/7.0/a1/yast-1.07.1-11.i386.rpm
[for the rpm]
ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/update/7.0/zq1/yast-1.07.1-11.src.rpm
[for the source]
and see for yourselves how SIMPLE! and comprehensive it is to use! if
you think it is so beneath you to do so, you have no basis to criticize
me! at least take a look at it to get an idea of what i am talking
about! i was able to run this on my linux-mandrake-7.0 `/', which is
almost completely incompatable with the suse-6.4 `/'. so it should
(hopefully run in any current elf `/' that supports redhat rpms.
====================================================================================
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