Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2025 22:01:26 +0100 From: Piotr Kubaj <pkubaj@freebsd.org> To: Al <al@datazap.net> Cc: Poul-Henning Kamp <phk@phk.freebsd.dk>, Minsoo Choo <minsoochoo0122@proton.me>, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>, "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" <arch@freebsd.org>, freebsd-ppc <freebsd-ppc@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: What's the plan for powerpc64 in FreeBSD 16 Message-ID: <aSdqppYvg5bWwuy6@talos-powerpc64le> In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.2511261539520.27486@agnus.datazap.net> References: <CANCZdfrQthqYeGYD_9LRcH94JJZuF2%2BUxAqf7Lcoe6p5VzJf9g@mail.gmail.com> <NqfDArT7jTPoIyfcShDccomNhLR9YUp1_S6kjK_NKIaiQVy2QK4n2KdbZIKm9gqda9fLP62MYQA-N5KOkECydNd1ktiUUuepzOVwCX8thgY=@proton.me> <202511261707.5AQH7N1u016543@critter.freebsd.dk> <Pine.NEB.4.64.2511261539520.27486@agnus.datazap.net>
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[-- Attachment #1 --] On 25-11-26 15:47:38, Al wrote: > > On Wed, 26 Nov 2025, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > > > Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2025 17:07:23 +0000 > > From: Poul-Henning Kamp <phk@phk.freebsd.dk> > > To: Minsoo Choo <minsoochoo0122@proton.me> > > Cc: Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>, > > "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" <arch@freebsd.org> > > Subject: Re: What's the plan for powerpc64 in FreeBSD 16 > > > > Minsoo Choo writes: > > > >> After reading replies, I still have questions why we should keep powerpc64be. > > > >> Second, regarding arguments about keeping big-endian support in codebase even > >> if no one actually physically runs the code: > >> This also applies to leaving 32-bit code (armv7) in tree for future > >> compatibility. > > > > I think that is a bit of a leap, although in principle I agree. > > > > However, I am much less convinced that a relevant new 32 bit platform > > will appear, than that somebody comes out with a 64 BE platform. > > > > Bit-rot is a thing, and unless we are willing to say "Screw anybody > > silly enough to create BE platform now or in the future" we should > > still guard against it. > > There is a number of new PowerPC 64 BE systems: > A1222 BE, but not 64-bit. It's supported via powerpcspe port on FreeBSD, which is already deprecated along with powerpc. > Sam460 several versions I'm not sure about that, I think it's also 32-bit. > Mirari (New PPC hardware) This one will be ugly, similarly to e5500. e5500 is 64-bit, but without Altivec, so it's below the usual baseline. Mirari will use e6500. e6500 supports BE with Altivec. It also supports LE, but without VSX. The current baseline for LE is POWER8, which supports VSX. e5500 works on FreeBSD, but requires building everything on your own, along with the OS itself, by using CPUTYPE?=e5500 in make.conf, otherwise Altivec instructions will be issued by clang. If we ever get binary packages on powerpc64, e5500 users will still need to build their own because of that. e6500 will be in the same boat when using LE, but will be fine on BE. > Also, https://www.powerpc-notebook.org/en/ powerpc-notebook has been in development for years, Mirari guys took much less to do much more. At this point, I don't believe powerpc-notebook will ever be released. > I am also told you can still buy X5000s new. > > > [-- Attachment #2 --] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQJPBAABCAA5FiEEycyIeNkkgohzsoorelmbhSCDnJ0FAmknaqYbFIAAAAAABAAO bWFudTIsMi41KzEuMTEsMCwyAAoJEHpZm4Ugg5ydIS4QAJztke5AKAQlWVrodkc3 PaNTnsfexgAVmogosQDeD9MYSujzRSN2lWt2stTXq4Lk5LuEirwFvihQz/+od3DL blv7Ox8W+6eB21lKYjNG6jjNfsTPIcL/LLOvSkrhF8uUleh0Kns8Finj6Hm8+CRZ 8ZHgWCGi0QstnxTqBcDzwf/NkI9Nhz4s9sTfBx3BEgjqbLpeaKxrP2cfS/5hYJLq nJ5aJeO3HwWpp06gdAx5q9k0BbMkWC14z4SQ0fzd+j0rWM/7+1gr7mvFyWqHBjJ9 6b3XrQpzI9ouJb7S+8i794Z49tQkyWivabNUBNLsODoa/yWizSKXgvzf4ZN5DtfC 0IVzIb/KZG5x/FOxxHy31F8V/rQGBAS6I38qtVvUsRdHieUXLuE+3i8U7b4PkFr2 rjMaS87VDD3nk3OQspqebz3rsR63LGS7VH0ysawx9Tu1l4hvygLTJ9U/SdiY3dgN PRYX1o5t3XTs4Pqsx0tg6btXrmMW8FGnfnwXf371512EpigYfS+UsucVd1LZ7b04 zu+TmA99ga7HeCs1twNv1PD81YyWyxFLH2+Q0cIeK4kGDgRJ2N+PXI+/Y87b8rL0 kDY3X9ikyFFeLU+23OIwzjDV1RvLz3Qg5KngX2aTktBwPyH17zceGEGIrImJ4h7P q6M8oK6T8wIQI+jrI01UyTWn =zsNv -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----home | help
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