Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 10:00:01 -0700 From: "Michael P. Sale" <mike@merchantsnet.com> To: "Studded" <Studded@san.rr.com> Cc: <freebsd-newbies@FreeBSD.ORG> Subject: back to the start (WAS Re: mounting floppy file systems) Message-ID: <01bd630f$c4b99d80$3706bccc@708644668>
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Doug, It all helps! You are right, this thread has turned into more of a Q&A than what the "intended" use for the list is supposed to be. It started because I spent a considerable amount of time trying to figure out why I could not get the floppy to mount as /A. I had ended up doing quite a bit of searching before using # mount -t msdos /dev/fd0 /mnt At this point, I thought that I had done the correct thing, (learn, learn, learn) and so put out an email that basically said something like: "hey, this command does not work in the book. I had to use /mnt instead of /A as the book recommended. Did I goof and miss something earlier in the book, or is this something that should be brought to the attention of Greg for an Errata." The point of the original post was not to ask why /A did not work ( I thought I could figure that out later ), but to figure out if that section of the book could be tweaked a little for newbies that did not fully understand everything that was happening on pg 211. I wanted fellow newbie opinions before I got slapped by someone for missing something earlier in the docs. In the process, the list ended up answering why /A did not work, thus seting up the runnning thread on mount vs mtools and all the other fun stuff. To finish my part of it, I'll say this. I am still looking for input from newbies concerning that particular section of the docs. If after reading this thread, no one thinks it's an issue, I'll crawl back into my cave and hunker back down for a while. If however, other folks were having trouble with it ( to include pg 211 -214 ) I think it would be nice to put together something that Greg can take a look at and consider putting into the Errata and maybe the next book. Specifically: Address why /A may not work. Again, I now believe that this is a simple concept that I MUST have glossed over, but would still like other opinions. Possibly address why to use mtools vs mount. It sounds simple, but it is not addressed in that chapter ( it may be somewhere else), and as we have seen by the responses, there is more than one way to skin a floppy. Mike loves opinions. Please send them. Thanks again to everyone! Mike ---------------------------------------------- Michael P. Sale MerchantsNet.Com mike@merchantsnet.com www.merchantsnet.com ---------------------------------------------- "Humility has no equal in the battle for knowledge" -- -----Original Message----- From: Studded <Studded@san.rr.com> To: Michael P. Sale <mike@merchantsnet.com> Cc: freebsd-newbies@freebsd.org <freebsd-newbies@freebsd.org> Date: Wednesday, April 08, 1998 1:53 AM Subject: Re: mounting floppy file systems >With all due respect to those involved, I'm having a hard time >understanding how this question-and-answer thread fits into the stated >goals for this list. Since I've obviously missed something I would >appreciate someone filling me in. However, since what's done is done >(and since I have always said that if a new users list exists questions >are inevitable) here's something I hope will clear some things up for >some of you. :) > >Michael P. Sale wrote: >> >> Yes!, Yes!, Yes! >> >> I was most certainly missing the point. > > We've all been there, don't sweat it. > >> I did not (apparently) correctly >> understand that the mounting process could actually use any available >> directory (or is that file system). > > I'm sure that there is a better definition for a file system, however I >generally think of a file system as something you can mount and unmount. >Yes, I know that's somewhat circular. :) A directory in unix is NOT >like a directory in DOS. It's not a place, it's a file that is actually >a list of other files if any (including other directories) that exist in >that part of the tree. This will be very much oversimplified mostly >because I'm not an expert, but here's the gist. > > Let's say your home directory is /usr/home/cabbage. In >/usr/home/cabbage you create a new directory called slaw, and "move" a >file called mayo "into" that directory. I put move in quotes because in >unix the files don't (generally) go anywhere, just the pointers to them. >:) Let's say the mayo file is at inode 3333. An inode is basically >where on the physical disk the OS goes to look for stuff. So at inode >3333 is the info contained in the file called mayo, which is now "in" >/usr/home/cabbage/slaw. The *file* that contains the "directory" >information for what should be in the slaw directory will now contain >the info that the OS needs to go to the disk and find the mayo file. >Yes, I know that's a bit dense, but bear with me. > > Now let's look at a directory being used as a mount point, like >/mnt/floppy. When you mount the floppy disk there that directory will >contain much more information than just a list of files. It will contain >information about the physical disk, where it is and how to access it, >and lots of complicated stuff I don't understand. :) /mnt/floppy will >become a "file system" because it contains not just the info about the >files, but HOW to access that info on a completely seperate partition >from the file system that the /mnt/floppy file/directory is on (which >would almost certainly be the / file system). This makes sense if you >really understand the previous paragraph. Directories contain >*information* about where and how to find the files that branch below >that directory in the tree. They don't contain the files themselves. > >> I assumed (don't say it) that there was >> something special about /mnt. Not completely understanding /etc/fstab did >> not help much either. > > There is a man page for fstab, but you're right, it's intermediate >level stuff. > >> Knowing this now, pg 211 clearly states that one is to mount the floppy on >> FILE SYSTEM /A. I suspect Greg figured that even a newbie would understand >> that mounting a floppy on /A would require a file system /A. Maybe I'm too >> used to the term "directory"!! Or again, maybe there is more info on this >> earlier in the book that would have clued me in. > > As far as I know greg's still on this list, so I'll let him address >this point. > >> I think I still believe that the page could supply a little more info (It's >> so easy to judge other peoples work), but with such a basic concept I can't >> believe that I didn't just gloss over it somewhere in the previous 12 >> chapters. I'll keep looking. > > It goes back to the old problem of all unix knowledge being circular. >It all depends on something else, you just have to fight your way in >somewhere. :) > >I hope this helps, > >Doug > >-- >*** Chief Operations Officer, DALnet IRC network *** >*** Proud operator, designer and maintainer of the world's largest >*** Internet Relay Chat server. 5,328 clients and still growing. >*** Try spider.dal.net on ports 6662-4 (Powered by FreeBSD) > To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-newbies" in the body of the message
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