Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2017 18:53:24 -0800 From: "Chris H" <bsd-lists@BSDforge.com> To: "Benno Rice" <benno@FreeBSD.org> Cc: <freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org>, <freebsd-arch@freebsd.org>, <sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> Subject: Re: The future of fortune(6) Message-ID: <5f4a62166aeb423a406a902bdc7078bc@udns.ultimatedns.net> In-Reply-To: <64AB4D76-B239-4E49-8D30-CF6D5D5D88A4@FreeBSD.org>
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On Wed, 22 Nov 2017 11:22:41 -0800 "Benno Rice" <benno@FreeBSD.org> said > > On Nov 22, 2017, at 09:35, Steve Kargl <sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu> > > wrote: > > > > On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 08:29:46AM -0800, Benno Rice wrote: > >> > >> With the removal of the fortune datfiles I think it’s time to > >> have a discussion about fortune(6). > > > > There should have been a discussion before the removal, but > > your method prevented an inevitable bikeshed. > > You’re correct in that my intent was to avoid pointless discussion. We’ve > got bigger and more fun things to work on than coming up with an editorial > policy as to what is or isn’t appropriate in the fortune datfiles. > > >> fortune now defaults to using a fortune file that no longer exists: > > > > When functionality is removed from src, a port is usually created. > > The datfiles should be available from ports/games/bsd-fortune. > > Feel free to create it. If someone else wants to take editorial > responsibility for those files I’m all for it. FreeBSD should not be taking > responsibility for them and I don’t wish to take that responsibility > either. > > >> $ fortune > >> No fortunes found in > > /usr/share/games/fortune:/usr/local/share/games/fortune. > >> > >> fortune is still used in the default .login/.profile to show entries > >> from the still existing freebsd-tips: > >> > >> $ grep fortune /usr/share/skel/* > >> /usr/share/skel/dot.login:if ( -x /usr/bin/fortune ) /usr/bin/fortune > > freebsd-tips > >> /usr/share/skel/dot.profile:if [ -x /usr/bin/fortune ] ; then > > /usr/bin/fortune freebsd-tips ; fi > >> $ fortune freebsd-tips > >> If you need a reminder to leave your terminal, type "leave +hhmm" where > >> "hhmm" represents in how many hours and minutes you need to leave. > >> -- Dru <genesis@istar.ca> > >> > >> fortune also still has flags for showing offensive entries and the like. > >> > > > > What is offensive to one person may not offend another person. What > > if someone objects to quotes by Dru (sorry Dru looks like you got > > picked at random above). The above looks like an attack on people > > with memory loss issues (age discrimination?). Will you remove Dru's > > quotes? > > Nice try. The freebsd-tips collection has some useful stuff which is why I > put forward the idea of keeping it. Comments like this are exactly why I got > rid of everything else. > > >> I would like people’s opinion on which of the following two paths we > >> should take: > >> > >> 1) Complete removal of fortune and freebsd-tips, remove its usage from > >> the default .login/.profile files. > > > > Create ports/games/bsd-fortune. > > Be my guest. > > >> 2) Reworking fortune(6) to remove the offensive fortune flag and > >> make freebsd-tips the default, possibly by symlinking it as > >> /usr/share/games/fortune/fortunes. > > > > 3) Restore the datfiles. Add a WITHOUT_FORTUNE knob and set it > > as the default. This allows an individual to tailor her system > > to meet her needs without having others force a politically > > correct revisionist history on them. > > Oh please. If you want the datfiles they’re there in history. If you want > to be the one distributing them, go ahead. I’m fairly sure that the > availability of quotes regarding, or by, Hitler or anyone else has been > diminished by a rounding error or less by us no longer distributing the > datfiles. FreeBSD is an operating system, not an encyclopedia. > > > This will be my one and only post in this bikeshed. Given the > > sudden removal of the datfiles without discussion. This appears > > to be a perfunctory discussion prior to you pursuing your own > > choice. > > Think of me whatever you want, I’m not fussed. I’m asking with 100% > honest intentions what the community wants to do with this tool. If the > consensus is for retaining fortune for use with the freebsd-tips datfile then > I’m absolutely cool with that. > > I made a unilateral decision to remove a potential source of pointless > distraction. I could’ve unilaterally removed fortune entirely at that point > but I didn’t as the freebsd-tips aspect appears to have actual utility and > is something we can easily manage. The other files weren’t. If this is about removing things from FreeBSD that don't offer/provide "utility". Than you *should* have removed /usr/games entirely. Let's *actually* be "completely honest" about all this. I think I'm done here. Sorry. :( > If they’re > important to you, please feel free to check out either r325781 (if you want > the files) or r325095 (if you want the files with the Hitler quotes) and > maintain them yourself. > > Cheers, > Benno. --Chrishelp
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