Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2019 08:17:48 -0800 From: Cy Schubert <Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com> To: freebsd-current@freebsd.org, Pete Wright <pete@nomadlogic.org>, "Rodney W. Grimes" <freebsd-rwg@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net>, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> Cc: Baptiste Daroussin <bapt@freebsd.org>, Niclas Zeising <zeising@freebsd.org>, "freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org" <freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org>, Stefan Blachmann <sblachmann@gmail.com>, FreeBSD Current <freebsd-current@freebsd.org>, Steve Kargl <sgk@troutmask.apl.washington.edu>, Vladimir Kondratyev <vladimir@kondratyev.su> Subject: Re: What is evdev and autoloading? Message-ID: <362D8283-0B7D-402F-99CD-657021597955@cschubert.com> In-Reply-To: <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org> References: <201902181650.x1IGoRsZ006131@pdx.rh.CN85.dnsmgr.net> <11a49d72-3158-1b9a-f933-6702d8f5c238@nomadlogic.org>
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On February 18, 2019 9:17:37 AM PST, Pete Wright <pete@nomadlogic.org> wrote: > > >On 2/18/19 8:50 AM, Rodney W. Grimes wrote: >>> On Mon, Feb 18, 2019 at 9:12 AM Rodney W. Grimes < >>> >>> I don't know. I think the fact that drm2 doesn't support anything >newer >>> than 5-year-old hardware is a pretty convincing evidence that the >old way >>> is broken and doesn't work. >> But it DOES work, I am pretty sure we have 1000's of users on that 5 >year >> old hardware that are totally happy with the intree DRM2 that is in >stable/12, >> and some of whom have ventured into head/13 are having issues with >thete a >> "new" model (ie kmod broken by a base commit). I know that there is >wip >> to get CI coverage for that, but wip is wip, and we need to start >changing >> the cart horse driver order we keep doing and get things right. Port >> up and working, with CI testing *before* we go remove kmod'ed code >from >> base would be a much more appropriate path. >> >> I think one serious problem here is the summary dismissal of things >> simply on the "5 year old" basis. Not everyone, and infact few now >> a days other than corporate buyers, can afford new hardware, >> giving the minimal performance increase in systems over the last 5 >> years the cost/benifit factor of a new computer is just too low. >I've put a lot of effort helping test and document how to get a usable >desktop environment on a modern laptop. there were two issues which >motivated me to do this: > >1) my observation that many developers at conferences and online were >using macOS as their primary desktop environment. when comparing this >to the OpenBSD and Linux community I felt pretty embarrassed, but it >did >explain the stagnant nature of our graphics subsystem. people seemed >afraid to touch things due the brittle nature of its hardware support. I noticed this too. And every time it struck me as odd. > >2) i was in need to an *affordable* machine with a warranty. >fortunately >there are many affordable laptops at staples, best-buy and amazon - but > >they were all post haswell systems, rendering them basically useless >from a FreeBSD perspective. Which is why removing drm2 was necessary. > >after trying to get traction to update the in-tree drm subsystem i was >lucky enough to sync up with the graphics team which was working on >syncing things up with modern hardware support. because of that i'm >now >able to get my small startup pretty much all on board with FreeBSD. i >use it on my workstations as well as on or server infrastructure >(physical and AWS). i would consider this a success for our community >as it's opened up the eyes to a whole new generation of devs to >FreeBSD. > >one thing missing from all of these arguments is real data. how many >people are on haswell era hardware? i can tell from my experience the >past several years the number of people who have post-haswell gear seem > >to be more numerous, or at least more vocal (and frankly easier to work > >with while squashing bugs). > >i can also say that personally it would be great to improve support for > >systems requiring drm2 - but that gear is hard to come by, so we are >really dependent on helpful collaboration from those who are being >effected. Drm2 is not required. My current laptop is 5 years old, an HD3000. The previous one is 13 years old, i915. Both work perfectly with drm-current on 13-current. Franky, I don't see what the fuss is about. > > >-pete > >-- >Pete Wright >pete@nomadlogic.org >@nomadlogicLA > >_______________________________________________ >freebsd-current@freebsd.org mailing list >https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-current >To unsubscribe, send any mail to >"freebsd-current-unsubscribe@freebsd.org" The only irritation with drm-current is after doing a NO_CLEAN build ARC is large enough that on occasion a video may not play because X is unable to get the memory. Other than that it works better than drm-legacy -- with no artifacts. -- Pardon the typos and autocorrect, small keyboard in use. Cheers, Cy Schubert <Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com> FreeBSD UNIX: <cy@FreeBSD.org> Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few.
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