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Date:      Tue, 23 Apr 2002 16:30:04 -0700
From:      Michael Sierchio <kudzu@tenebras.com>
To:        Mike Meyer <mwm-dated-1020021589.a2edd3@mired.org>
Cc:        Lucky Green <shamrock@cypherpunks.to>, freebsd-stable@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: /etc/defaults/rc.conf theory
Message-ID:  <3CC5EE7C.2030407@tenebras.com>
References:  <002d01c1ea7d$cf1cb060$c33a080a@LUCKYVAIO>	<3CC4E3D4.6010603@tenebras.com> <15557.46037.660880.582373@guru.mired.org>

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Mike Meyer wrote:

> I don't find it difficult at all. Then again, I make liberal use of
> the NO_* options in /etc/make.conf. I suggest you do the same.

I've taken to doing so, but I think it's better
to have packages and say YES to the things I explicitly want.

> We clearly aren't including "everything". There's lots of stuff that
> isn't included. In fact, the *only* two reasons I've ever run into for
> adding something to the base system was that 1) it's required to build
> part of the base system, or 2) it's become a critical component of a
> complete system.

I think the argument can be made that even critical components
could be packaged.  It means that a minimally functional system
will have some packages, maybe a dozen or so.  That's not bad.
A standard Solaris 8 server install has more than a *thousand*.

> Some mailer and some ssh need to be part of the base system. If they
> aren't up to snuff for you and you aren't happy disabling things in
> the base system and installing ports, then you need to find someone to
> maintain a version you want as part of the base system, and then
> convince everyone else that this is better. Tracking OpenSSL/OpenSSH
> closer is probably an easy sell. The same is not true for sendmail.

A mailer isn't needed for a dedicated router, or several other
types of appliance.  Neither is ssh, if you connect exclusively
via the serial console.  Of course I have ssh installed (I already
confessed).  I just wish configuration were easier.

Why shouldn't everything be a package?  Well, not the kernel, loader,
etc.  but nearly everything in userland.


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