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Date:      Mon, 12 Apr 2004 23:41:58 +0200
From:      Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz>
To:        freebsd-isp@freebsd.org
Subject:   Re: mail server recommendations?
Message-ID:  <407B0D26.9060201@quip.cz>
In-Reply-To: <200404121527.46330.mjohnston@skyweb.ca>
References:  <20040412173824.GC13343@bewilderbeast.blackhelicopters.org> <200404121301.41643.mjohnston@skyweb.ca> <407AF242.1020601@quip.cz> <200404121527.46330.mjohnston@skyweb.ca>

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Mark Johnston wrote:

> Miroslav Lachman <000.fbsd@quip.cz> wrote:
> 
>>Hi, I am running similar configuration on several machines (Postfix +
>>Courier-IMAP [with POP3ssl/IMAP4ssl] + MySQL). I have a guestion about
>>one general difference - unique UID / GID for each user. I guess it
>>provide more security, but also some troubles. If all virtual users
>>(stored in MySQL) have same UID/GID, postfix can be configured to create
>>maildirs itself with first incoming message. If each user has unique
>>UID, maildirs must be created manualy (or from shellscript) and chowned
>>to UID/GID.
> 
> 
> Exactly - that's the tradeoff.
> 
> 
>>My question: "If all virtual users have same UID/GID, is there some real
>>security risk?".
> 
> 
> Sharing UIDs and GIDs can have good or bad effects on security.  On a server 
> with no users logging in, like mine, it's moot; nobody (well, nobody who 
> hasn't compromised the server) can get at the maildir storage on disk, so 
> nobody (ditto) can play with the mailboxes.  On a server where users do log 
> in, you can go two routes:
> 
> - Unique UIDs/GIDs.  This makes things more convenient for the user, since 
> they can use mail clients on the server and get right at their mail.  If you 
> want to have local mail clients work at all, you have to do this.
> 
> - Shared UID/GID.  In this case, the user can't get at their own maildir, and 
> they'll have to use LDAP/POP3 over loopback to read their mail.  It does make 
> management easier, though.
> 
> It sounds to me like you're working with a server where users don't log in, 
> since you're using MySQL to manage user accounts.  In that case, unique UIDs 
> buy you essentially nothing.
> 

Yes, I am one and only who has shell account (logging via SSH), users 
have FTP, POP3/IMAP/webmail, HTTP access and CVS (CVSd pserver throught 
SSL [stunnel])

> 
>>I'll be glad to read if same UID/GID is secure or not, because I am
>>writing webbased administration tool in PHP and main problem is creation
>>of maildirs for new accounts. Same UID/GID could solve my problem.
> 
> 
> The only time that unique UIDs and GIDs are useful is when the user will be 
> logging in locally, so you can just look in /etc/passwd, find the user's UID, 
> and create the maildir with that.  If the user doesn't have a system account, 
> you've got no reason to start making up UIDs to give them one; just share a 
> single UID.
> 
> 
>>PS: sorry for my bad english and a little offtopic message
> 
> 
> Since you say "offtopic", I assume you intended this for the freebsd-isp list, 
> instead of private mail.  I've taken the liberty of including the list in the 
> Cc again, since security advice like this shouldn't go unreviewed.  :)  You 
> might also want to move this thread to freebsd-security@freebsd.org, to reach 
> people with more security know-how.
> 

I am sorry for my mistake, I really intended this for freebsd-isp list 
and I'll send it to freebsd-security too.

Thank you for your opinion.

> 
>>PPS: I'll publish webbased administration tool on sourceforge.net after
>>completition
> 
> 

One more question - does anybody know some webbased administration tools 
for email accounts of postfix virtual users in MySQL/PgSQL? (I started 
writing my own, but I am still interested in comparison with other tools)

-- 
Miroslav Lachman
Webapplication Developer



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