Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2024 15:00:06 -0800 From: Kevin Oberman <rkoberman@gmail.com> To: Mario Marietto <marietto2008@gmail.com> Cc: David Chisnall <theraven@freebsd.org>, Mark Millard <marklmi@yahoo.com>, John F Carr <jfc@mit.edu>, freebsd-arm <freebsd-arm@freebsd.org>, freebsd-hackers <freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org>, FreeBSD Mailing List <freebsd-questions@freebsd.org>, "freebsd-xen@freebsd.org" <freebsd-xen@freebsd.org>, FreeBSD Current <freebsd-current@freebsd.org>, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>, =?UTF-8?Q?Roger_Pau_Monn=C3=A9?= <royger@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: How to upgrade an EOL FreeBSD release or how to make it working again Message-ID: <CAN6yY1u5QLeD=8=i3wZBfViFLXoyx=fpY62QG_GBRc4STptaHw@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <CA%2B1FSijqbF9CNw_oAHAEbLqb02Hq5L79WJV=RDfrtGgqgMp1%2Bg@mail.gmail.com> References: <CA%2B1FSihU4WJWbbD9k9th4GXvyAKTL3URic-BAFUY7Og=wLn27A@mail.gmail.com> <CA390EE5-3339-4A15-8087-C28B309FA523@mit.edu> <CA%2B1FSih6j0QP9nKkxFCjMCeuMdvJca3WxVsi8%2BQaN2sV8YO-zw@mail.gmail.com> <D435604C-70F1-454D-B3AE-CD4D7C99D383@FreeBSD.org> <CA%2B1FSijqbF9CNw_oAHAEbLqb02Hq5L79WJV=RDfrtGgqgMp1%2Bg@mail.gmail.com>
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--000000000000836581060f03fa2e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Old packages are not retained after EOL, but ports are version agnostic (more or less, as the current ports tree is only ar tested to run on supported versions and some are marked as "BROKEN" for some versions). All ports are available from the GIT repo (cgit.freebsd.org). On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 10:49=E2=80=AFAM Mario Marietto <marietto2008@gmail= .com> wrote: > Hello. > > Do you have deleted forever the set of packages and ports for FreeBSD 11 > or you keep them stored in DVDs that I can buy or download for a small > amount of money ? If yes,where ? To rebuild everything is out of my > expertise. > > On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 7:15=E2=80=AFPM David Chisnall <theraven@freebsd.= org> > wrote: > >> On 15 Jan 2024, at 16:46, Mario Marietto <marietto2008@gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> > The ARM Chromebook is based on armv7,it is still recent. >> >> For reference, the ARMv7 architecture was introduced in 2005. The last >> cores that implemented the architecture were released in 2014. This is = not >> a =E2=80=98recent=E2=80=99 architecture, it=E2=80=99s one that=E2=80=99s= 19 years old and has been largely >> dead for several years. >> >> > But let's change perspective for a moment,don't think about the ARM >> Chromebook. My question is : how to upgrade FreeBSD when it goes EOL. >> >> Generally, run `freebsd-update`. This is a very different question from >> =E2=80=98how do I do a new install of an old an unsupported version?' >> >> > I ask this because there is a huge difference here between FreeBSD and >> Linux. Today if you need to use , for example Ubuntu 14.0, you can use i= t >> as is. Yes,there will be a lot of bugs,but it will work without crashes. >> But if you want to use an old FreeBSD system,nothing will work for you. >> So,do you know some methods to install even packages or ports ? You >> know,there are cases when you need to do some experiments so that you ca= n >> keep your machine off the internet,so you aren't scared that someone can >> compromise it. Totally prohibiting the users to use an old system,removi= ng >> ports and packages is not a choice that I approve of. And I'm not the on= ly >> one that thinks like this. >> >> If you want to use an old and unsupported version of FreeBSD, no one is >> stopping you, but: >> >> - You will need to build the releases. The source code is still in git= , >> you can. The scripts for building the release images are right there in >> the repo. Just grab the relevant release or releng branch and go. >> >> - You will need to build packages. Newer versions of the ports tree >> will not be tested with the older release, so you may need to use an old= er >> checkout of the ports tree. Poudriere will build a package repo for you= . >> >> In both cases, if you=E2=80=99re using older versions you almost certain= ly *will* >> have security vulnerabilities. The project strongly advises you not to = do >> this and not to blame us when you install known-insecure software and en= d >> up compromised. >> >> The project does not have enough active contributors to keep maintaining >> things indefinitely. This is why release have a five-year supported >> lifetime. If you want to pick up an old branch and maintain it, you=E2= =80=99re >> welcome to. In the past, companies have picked up old branches and >> maintained them for customers that had a dependency on them. If you wan= t >> to pay someone to maintain an old branch (and have deep pockets) then th= ere >> are probably a few companies that will happily take your money. >> >> Maintaining binaries is a slightly different issue, but it=E2=80=99s not= totally >> unrelated. Keeping old packages around consumes disk space and costs th= e >> project money (remember, every package is mirrored across the CDN, so th= is >> isn=E2=80=99t just a single disk). Even if it were free, philosophicall= y, I think >> making it easy for users to install known-insecure software is a bad ide= a >> but if you want to keep a package repo with out-of-date packages online >> indefinitely then you can. You can run Poudriere and even cross-compile >> from a fairly beefy cloud machine quite easily. >> >> It=E2=80=99s been a while since I did a full package build, but I would = guess >> that you could do a single package build (all ports) for about $50 on a >> cloud VM, more (2-3x) if it=E2=80=99s emulated. Storing the results for= a small >> number of users will cost around $10-20/month. If you think this is an >> important thing to do, then you are absolutely welcome to spend your own >> money on doing it. >> >> David >> >> > > -- > Mario. > --=20 Kevin Oberman, Part time kid herder and retired Network Engineer E-mail: rkoberman@gmail.com PGP Fingerprint: D03FB98AFA78E3B78C1694B318AB39EF1B055683 --000000000000836581060f03fa2e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:tahoma,s= ans-serif;font-size:small">Old packages are not retained after EOL, but por= ts are version agnostic (more or less, as the current ports tree is only ar= tested to run on supported versions and some are marked as "BROKEN&qu= ot; for some versions). All ports are available from the GIT repo (<a href= =3D"http://cgit.freebsd.org">cgit.freebsd.org</a>).<br></div></div><br><div= class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Jan 15= , 2024 at 10:49=E2=80=AFAM Mario Marietto <<a href=3D"mailto:marietto200= 8@gmail.com">marietto2008@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote cla= ss=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid = rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Hello.</div><div><= br></div><div>Do you have deleted forever the set of packages and ports for= FreeBSD 11 or you keep them stored in DVDs that I can buy or download for = a small amount of money ? If yes,where ? To rebuild everything is out of my= expertise. <br></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr"= class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Jan 15, 2024 at 7:15=E2=80=AFPM David Chisnal= l <<a href=3D"mailto:theraven@freebsd.org" target=3D"_blank">theraven@fr= eebsd.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style= =3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding= -left:1ex">On 15 Jan 2024, at 16:46, Mario Marietto <<a href=3D"mailto:m= arietto2008@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">marietto2008@gmail.com</a>> wro= te:<br> > <br> > The ARM Chromebook is based on armv7,it is still recent.<br> <br> For reference, the ARMv7 architecture was introduced in 2005.=C2=A0 The las= t cores that implemented the architecture were released in 2014.=C2=A0 This= is not a =E2=80=98recent=E2=80=99 architecture, it=E2=80=99s one that=E2= =80=99s 19 years old and has been largely dead for several years.<br> <br> > But let's change perspective for a moment,don't think about th= e ARM Chromebook. My question is : how to upgrade FreeBSD when it goes EOL.= <br> <br> Generally, run `freebsd-update`.=C2=A0 This is a very different question fr= om =E2=80=98how do I do a new install of an old an unsupported version?'= ;<br> <br> > I ask this because there is a huge difference here between FreeBSD and= Linux. Today if you need to use , for example Ubuntu 14.0, you can use it = as is. Yes,there will be a lot of bugs,but it will work without crashes.=C2= =A0 But if you want to use an old FreeBSD system,nothing will work for you.= So,do you know some methods to install even packages or ports ? You know,t= here are cases when you need to do some experiments so that you can keep yo= ur machine off the internet,so you aren't scared that someone can compr= omise it. Totally prohibiting the users to use an old system,removing ports= and packages is not a choice that I approve of. And I'm not the only o= ne that thinks like this.<br> <br> If you want to use an old and unsupported version of FreeBSD, no one is sto= pping you, but:<br> <br> =C2=A0- You will need to build the releases.=C2=A0 The source code is still= in git, you can.=C2=A0 The scripts for building the release images are rig= ht there in the repo.=C2=A0 Just grab the relevant release or releng branch= and go.<br> <br> =C2=A0- You will need to build packages.=C2=A0 Newer versions of the ports = tree will not be tested with the older release, so you may need to use an o= lder checkout of the ports tree.=C2=A0 Poudriere will build a package repo = for you.=C2=A0 <br> <br> In both cases, if you=E2=80=99re using older versions you almost certainly = *will* have security vulnerabilities.=C2=A0 The project strongly advises yo= u not to do this and not to blame us when you install known-insecure softwa= re and end up compromised.<br> <br> The project does not have enough active contributors to keep maintaining th= ings indefinitely.=C2=A0 This is why release have a five-year supported lif= etime.=C2=A0 If you want to pick up an old branch and maintain it, you=E2= =80=99re welcome to.=C2=A0 In the past, companies have picked up old branch= es and maintained them for customers that had a dependency on them.=C2=A0 I= f you want to pay someone to maintain an old branch (and have deep pockets)= then there are probably a few companies that will happily take your money.= <br> <br> Maintaining binaries is a slightly different issue, but it=E2=80=99s not to= tally unrelated.=C2=A0 Keeping old packages around consumes disk space and = costs the project money (remember, every package is mirrored across the CDN= , so this isn=E2=80=99t just a single disk).=C2=A0 Even if it were free, ph= ilosophically, I think making it easy for users to install known-insecure s= oftware is a bad idea but if you want to keep a package repo with out-of-da= te packages online indefinitely then you can.=C2=A0 You can run Poudriere a= nd even cross-compile from a fairly beefy cloud machine quite easily.<br> <br> It=E2=80=99s been a while since I did a full package build, but I would gue= ss that you could do a single package build (all ports) for about $50 on a = cloud VM, more (2-3x) if it=E2=80=99s emulated.=C2=A0 Storing the results f= or a small number of users will cost around $10-20/month.=C2=A0 If you thin= k this is an important thing to do, then you are absolutely welcome to spen= d your own money on doing it.<br> <br> David<br> <br> </blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><br><span class=3D"gmail_signature_pre= fix">-- </span><br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature">Mario.<br></d= iv> </blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><br><span class=3D"gmail_signature_pre= fix">-- </span><br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"l= tr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr">Kevin= Oberman, Part time kid herder and retired Network Engineer<br>E-mail: <a h= ref=3D"mailto:rkoberman@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">rkoberman@gmail.com</a= ><br></div><div>PGP Fingerprint: D03FB98AFA78E3B78C1694B318AB39EF1B055683</= div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div> --000000000000836581060f03fa2e--
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