Date: Thu, 21 Dec 1995 13:59:58 -0600 From: sjb@universe.digex.net To: Eric Siegerman <erics@now.com> Cc: Blas Zappa <jpw687@mail.usask.ca>, security@freebsd.org Subject: Re: legal to export DES outside of the US via Canada? Message-ID: <9512211959.AA14454@ozymandias.austin.ibm.com> In-Reply-To: (Your message of Tue, 19 Dec 1995 17:35:38 CST.) <951219173538.5102@now.com>
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Eric Siegerman writes >Blas Zappa <jpw687@mail.usask.ca> wrote: >> At 12:48 PM 12/15/95 -0600, you wrote: >> >> >U.S. law doesn't (normally) apply to Canadian citizens, even though the >> >U.S. LEAs seem to think it should, so, having received ITAR-controlled >> >code under the above exemption, the Canadian citizen may do with it >> >what he will. It violates only the agreement he made with the >> >exporter, not law. No one will come to get him, >> >> [...] >> if this is the >> case, and anyone wishes to export out of this continent I'd be glad to be a >> redistributor/courier.. This is still a problem. The U.S. government can still prosecute the person who sent it to you if they can make a reasonable case that the American knew you'd re-export. *You're* safe, but he isn't. >I'd advise looking into just how Canada's ITAR exemption came to >be. I don't know, but I find it rather hard to imagine the US >defence establishment allowing the exemption to be granted unless >the Canadian government had agreed to enforce the US rules when >it comes to reexporting, and had passed the laws necessary to >implement that agreement. >From what I've heard on lists where the subject is important, the "loophole" is real. Canada *does* have laws which cover the vast majority of ITAR. The general state of relaxed trade restrictions with Canada makes it necessary that the government be willing to overlook the little bit that isn't covered. >You may find CSIS or the RCMP on your case -- with *Canadian* law >on their side -- or it may turn out that the first person quoted >above is right, and you can reexport with impunity. But it would >be wise to investigate *first*! True of any legal advice from lay persons. >> >and the [American, I presume you meant] exporter >> >should be safe from judgements. > >But not necessarily from harassment; just ask Steve Jackson. > >Besides which, does anyone know what burden is laid by the >ITAR-exemption rule on Americans who export restricted stuff to >Canada under its terms? It may make them legally responsible if >the Canadian they (legally) export to then re-exports without the >proper licences. This may be hard to get a conviction on in case >of freeware, but "they" can make life pretty miserable in the >meantime. I'm pretty sure that getting some form of agreement from the Canadian to not export should be enough, assuming there isn't reason to think you knew the agreement to be false. Being on the list and having seen the above quoted message from Blas Zappa, it probably wouldn't be enough to have some sort of verbal agreement from him.help
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