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Date:      Wed, 23 Jan 2002 22:52:14 -0800 (PST)
From:      "f.johan.beisser" <jan@caustic.org>
To:        "Matthew D. Fuller" <fullermd@over-yonder.net>
Cc:        chip <chip@wiegand.org>, Terry Lambert <tlambert2@mindspring.com>, David Schultz <dschultz@uclink.Berkeley.EDU>, <freebsd-chat@freebsd.org>
Subject:   Re: FreeBSD Intaller (was "Re: ... RedHat ...")
Message-ID:  <20020123224541.E32624-100000@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <20020124004312.A2760@over-yonder.net>

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On Thu, 24 Jan 2002, Matthew D. Fuller wrote:

> For instance, when using SLIP (or hardwired PPP or PLIP, I imagine),
> you're in deep trouble if you've never done it before.  You have to
> remember to put in the 'other ifconfig options' section the far-end
> address of the link, or it won't work; unless you've manually ifconfig'd
> SLIP lines a number of times, you'll forget.  Then it'll run slattach.
> If you don't get it right the first time, you're screwed, because it'll
> never clear the old attachment correctly.  Gotta reboot and start over.

i think most people doing that level of a fringe install are fairly
hardcore users, and they're willing to make those kinds of mistakes. the
rare newbie that will do a SLIP install will probably be digging up quite
a bit of documentation. after several years of working with, and on,
FreeBSD, i can't say i've once had to do a SLIP install, even on "low end"
hardware.

> As Terry mentioned, there are several ways to foul-up yourself into a
> tight little corner in the disk partitioning (and that's if you KNOW what
> you're doing.  The first time through, it can be kinda hairy just
> figuring out what you're doing).  And, as Jordan has ranted about on a
> few occasions, the UI is painted into a rather small corner by virtue of
> the dialog library it uses.  Ever have that joy in places like the
> 'custom distribution choices' for the custom installation, where you're
> not quite sure whether enter or space is select, and the wrong choice
> will bump you back menus?

i admit, this has happened to me. more often than i care to think about.

> And, of course, that's not even getting into the "other" issues which
> require a more thorough packaging system to handle correctly (Tried
> installing, then installing X?  It dumps on a few compat_* sets.  Even if
> you already installed them.  Sucks on a modem, lemme tell ya).

no comment. i gave up on doing "direct X installs" in freebsd during the
2.2 series. it's just easier to do from ports, or to install the package.

> It works apparently smoothly in the best-case.  In most simple-cases, it
> won't feel worse than rough-around-the-edges.  Start making mistakes, or
> trying to get intricate, though, and it feels rather like wearing your
> high school sweater to your 30th reunion.

i don't find it to be "rough-around-the-edges," if anything, the FreeBSD
installer is quick, and relatively painless to handle. given a little
reading, and a bit of practice, even the novice user ends up warming up to
it.

-- jan

-------/ f. johan beisser /--------------------------------------+
  http://caustic.org/~jan                      jan@caustic.org
    "John Ashcroft is really just the reanimated corpse
         of J. Edgar Hoover." -- Tim Triche


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