Date: Fri, 21 May 2021 05:02:53 +0200 From: Peter Libassi <peter@libassi.se> To: Ian Lepore <ian@freebsd.org> Cc: cem@freebsd.org, Michael Gmelin <freebsd@grem.de>, "freebsd-current@freebsd.org" <freebsd-current@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: Reducing SIGINFO verbosity Message-ID: <D7364004-DAD9-4325-B8F0-70C22530583E@libassi.se> In-Reply-To: <80625b01dd7a2740a23c22370741665e5d2ff6e5.camel@freebsd.org> References: <20210520180155.3e23500e@bsd64.grem.de> <20210520185917.GL14975@funkthat.com> <CAG6CVpWpDYid9F0fSWyyFVuh6SuNmV4HwEBQUKTCXDGfq6KwAw@mail.gmail.com> <80625b01dd7a2740a23c22370741665e5d2ff6e5.camel@freebsd.org>
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> 21 maj 2021 kl. 03:42 skrev Ian Lepore <ian@freebsd.org>: >=20 > On Thu, 2021-05-20 at 15:57 -0700, Conrad Meyer wrote: >> No, I don=E2=80=99t think there=E2=80=99s any reason to default it = differently on >> stable vs >> current. I think it=E2=80=99s useful (and I prefer the more verbose = form, >> which >> isn=E2=80=99t the default). >>=20 >> Conrad >>=20 >=20 > So... there are thousands of freebsd users, who don't care about this > noisy stack trace stuff at all. And there are dozens of freebsd > developers, and amongst them there are maybe, what... a half dozen at > best that want this info when they hit ^T? >=20 > So clearly, the right decision is to make maximal noise the default, > and not just in the development branches. It doesn't matter how much > it bothers the users as long as a few developers are happy. >=20 > And people moan about freebsd's dwindling user base and wonder why = it's > withering away. >=20 > =E2=80=94 Ian >=20 >=20 Well, from my 30+ years in the business I=E2=80=99ve learned that = developers actually don=E2=80=99t care about the users. For assessment = of new features and maintaining the usability of a product there are = Architects and Architect forums.=20 The correct and conservative way would have been that this change passed = the forum and there a desicion was made to enable/disable the new = feature _and_ regardless, inform the users via the release notes and = man pages of the new feature, including information how they can = enable/disable the new feature.=20 /Peter
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