Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2002 22:42:09 -0600 From: "Mike Meyer" <mwm-dated-1015476130.ae9a04@mired.org> To: Brad Knowles <brad.knowles@skynet.be> Cc: freebsd-chat@freebsd.org Subject: Re: OS-X question(WAS:GUI question.) Message-ID: <15488.22561.561401.514625@guru.mired.org> In-Reply-To: <p05101404b8a6032680e1@[10.0.1.29]> References: <Pine.LNX.4.43.0203011432131.2796-100000@pilchuck.reedmedia.net> <p0510140fb8a5bc92819a@[10.0.1.26]> <200203010532.AAA17582@alpha.vaxxine.com> <p05101403b8a5459d1362@[10.0.1.26]> <200203012019.PAA14268@uce55.uchaswv.edu> <p0510140bb8a59e566b67@[10.0.1.26]> <20020302004028.A90395@clan.nothing-going-on.org> <15488.17307.182886.938736@guru.mired.org> <p05101404b8a6032680e1@[10.0.1.29]>
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Brad Knowles <brad.knowles@skynet.be> types: > At 9:14 PM -0600 2002/03/01, Mike Meyer wrote: > > How well does it integrate apps that expect to run on Aqua, or > > whatever apple's UI is called? Can I still use them if I'm running > > X11? Do they expect part of their interface to be provided by the > > environment, which caused problems for Motif-specific applications on > > non-Motif window managers? > Well, I've never used it myself, but it should let you use both > at the same time -- Aqua apps use Aqua and display on the screen, and > X11 apps use X11 and display on the same screen. Yes, but. I remember the first SunView/NeWS multiprotocol GUI. SunView windows floated on top of all NeWS windows. Always. They eventually fixed that, but it sure was a pain at the time. SO the next question is where does the X window manager fit into the picture? If I try to use it's resize, lower, etc. functions on an aqau app, what happens? I don't know enough about Aqua to know if the converse question even applies. > > I agree with that. It's also one of the worst things about the Mac. To > > paraphrase, you can have it in any flaver you like, just so long as > > you like apple. > There are always exceptions to the rule, but the Macintosh HIG > work pretty well for the vast majority of the time. Violate these > rules on the Mac at your own extreme peril -- damn, damn few apps > have ever done so and managed to actually make an improvement. I think the key words were "of the time". The way people use computers has changed drastically since the early 80s. I hadn't seen any changes in Apple's UI philosphy between then and '98 that took that into account. Lots of new sizzle, but it was still the same steak - and people are becoming vegetarians. > > I'd have to go digging the numbers up, but a GOMS-level analysis of > > the X11 bloated window managers vs. my not-bloated widow manager shows > > that the expected time to complete a window management task is well > > under 50% for my version. The Mac wouldn't fair as well as X11 does > > under the same analysis. > I'd be interested in seeing those results. I'll try to find them. If worst comes to worst, it wouldn't take more than an evening or two to rerun the calculations. <mike -- Mike Meyer <mwm@mired.org> http://www.mired.org/home/mwm/ Independent WWW/Perforce/FreeBSD/Unix consultant, email for more information. To Unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo@FreeBSD.org with "unsubscribe freebsd-chat" in the body of the message
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