Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2025 21:57:33 +0300 From: Vadim Goncharov <vadimnuclight@gmail.com> To: Minsoo Choo <minsoochoo0122@proton.me> Cc: Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com>, "freebsd-arch@freebsd.org" <arch@freebsd.org> Subject: BE (Was: What's the plan for powerpc64 in FreeBSD 16) Message-ID: <20251117215733.65553140@nuclight.lan> In-Reply-To: <Wd6TGx4GOC1XbKnCdGB3NtUUvsaFLiRqb_aW7m29BKARRj41wbyYiH5IHjZPEBe3Qs_SQ5DOKORCzEPDRqC01whFEwWcKeNtb27lTJGpb4M=@proton.me> References: <CANCZdfrQthqYeGYD_9LRcH94JJZuF2%2BUxAqf7Lcoe6p5VzJf9g@mail.gmail.com> <Wd6TGx4GOC1XbKnCdGB3NtUUvsaFLiRqb_aW7m29BKARRj41wbyYiH5IHjZPEBe3Qs_SQ5DOKORCzEPDRqC01whFEwWcKeNtb27lTJGpb4M=@proton.me>
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On Mon, 17 Nov 2025 18:29:20 +0000 Minsoo Choo <minsoochoo0122@proton.me> wrote: > I was thinking about this as well since the discussion on armv7. I think > big-endian powerpc should be removed from releases from FreeBSD 16 for the > following reasons. > > - Big endian usage is not used widely anymore. Even most POWER systems on > linux run on little-endian, and most Linux distros like RHEL only provides > little-endian and not big-endian. > - As FreeBSD is a complete operating system, if the powerpc is causing > issues not only in kernel but also for utilities and ports due to lack of > developers and hardware, there is no need to maintain them. Linux is a > kernel, so Linux developers can maintain kernel only for powerpc64be and > other developers take the responsibility of implementing libraries and > utilities. FreeBSD cannot take this approach, and if the cost is bigger than > the benefit, we should remove it. > - This also applies to deprecation of 32-bit platforms, but there is no need > to consider big endian compatibility unless we have valid reason. So far, > all the major platforms we support are little-endian or bi-endian, and even > bi-endian platforms like aarch64 and POWER mostly run on little endian > operating systems. Is there a new architecture or even ongoing discussion of > them that will be based on big endian (or 32-bit) where FreeBSD can shine? > If not, there is no need to consider compatibility for future architectures. This does not mean that such will never arise in the future, especially given that big-endian is better; and there were such rumors/tries for RISC-V. > - I think we should've dropped powerpc bi-endian support when we dropped > armv6 as powerpc predates armv6. I've seen some old armv6 hardware few > times, but I've never seen big-endian only powerpc hardware in my life. I'm > still thinking on which position to take for the armv7 discussion, but I'm > definitely leaning towards deprecation for powerpc64be's case. > > I think we should've dropped powerpc bi-endian support when we dropped armv6 > as powerpc predates armv6. I've seen some old armv6 hardware few times, but > I've never seen big-endian only powerpc hardware in my life. I'm still > thinking on which position to take for the armv7 discussion, but I'm > definitely leaning towards deprecation for powerpc64be's case. > > -- WBR, @nuclight
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