Date: Sat, 05 Jan 2019 11:53:56 -0800 From: Cy Schubert <Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com> To: Enji Cooper <yaneurabeya@gmail.com> Cc: Wojciech Puchar <wojtek@puchar.net>, Cy Schubert <Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com>, Igor Mozolevsky <igor@hybrid-lab.co.uk>, Hackers freeBSD <freebsd-hackers@freebsd.org> Subject: Re: Strategic Thinking (was: Re: Speculative: Rust for base system components) Message-ID: <201901051953.x05JrucZ071109@slippy.cwsent.com> In-Reply-To: Message from Enji Cooper <yaneurabeya@gmail.com> of "Sat, 05 Jan 2019 10:38:27 -0800." <0EB517DF-376E-435A-B24D-A4964D0F148F@gmail.com>
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In message <0EB517DF-376E-435A-B24D-A4964D0F148F@gmail.com>, Enji Cooper writes : > On Jan 5, 2019, at 07:07, Wojciech Puchar <wojtek@puchar.net> wrote: > > >>>> A) FreeBSD needs to become a platform that can host current and > >>>> evolving virtualization technologies. > >>>> > >>>> B) FreeBSD should be able to play in the container space similarly to > >>>> Linux. Unfortunately I believe that this horse has left the barn and it > >>>> may be too late. Then again maybe there is something we can redeem. > >>> > >>> C) Make FreeBSD like others. So why making FreeBSD? > >> > >> Because we offer some technologies the others do not. Unfortunately > >> inferior and incompatible approaches (similarly: VHS vs BETA, Blue Ray > >> vs HD) have left us on the outside. Try porting Kubernetes to FreeBSD. > > no need to. > > Actually, not having Docker/Kubernetes support makes it more difficult to rid > e the CI/distributed system wave, requiring FreeBSD to reinvent the wheel to > do CI, and force various groups to write their own homegrown distributed syst > ems infrastructures instead of leveraging existing technologies. > > >> The technologies used today are more than just fads. They are building > >> blocks onto which future technologies will be built. > >> > > and this is really sad. > > Not really. It’s a sign of maturity as most things now run on a “cloud ba > sed” infrastructure, or small embedded OSes running embedded Linux (not Fre > eBSD). > > >>> Not everyone needs the same. > >> > >> Niche. We should be more than simply a desktop O/S (which BTW I use as > >> my primary desktop) and we should be more than a simple bare metal O/S. > > > > Simple bare metal O/S is what is really needed. > > Not really. As Cy pointed out, in order to ensure that FreeBSD is well-suppor > ted by large companies (Dell, Facebook via WhatsApp, Juniper, and Sony were s > ome of the large contributors over the past couple years, along with a host o > f other smaller storage companies), so it continues to exist in a healthy way > , it needs to be dynamic and customizable to meet the needs from embedded dev > elopment up to large-scale distributed systems. A number of these companies h > ave considered switching away from FreeBSD to Linux because FreeBSD is niche > (see Microsoft with Hotmail, Yahoo, etc). Let’s not give developers willing > to make the switch more ammunition to do so. This has everything to do with relevance. Look at where illumos and all the other *BSDs are. They're pretty much hobbyist operating systems. The discussion on an illumos developers mailing list has given me that impression as well. At $JOB my customers are migrating from AIX, Solaris and even Windows to Linux and from traditional Linux to microservices run under OpenShift. As I told my manager at $JOB those many years ago, the operating system will become a stub. We are now realizing this. The other thing I see at $JOB is the network is now being virtualized using NSX. Our Checkpoint firewalls are no longer physical but virtual. FreeBSD with jails and VIMAGE is in a great position to play in this space as well. An example might be, at $JOB we are using vRO and vRA but it could be as easily done using Kubernetes and ansible to centrally manage network of virtual and physical FreeBSD based firewalls. -- Cheers, Cy Schubert <Cy.Schubert@cschubert.com> FreeBSD UNIX: <cy@FreeBSD.org> Web: http://www.FreeBSD.org The need of the many outweighs the greed of the few.
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